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Sensational 7: Rankings

Which of the Sensational 7 will have the best college career?

  • Total voters
    135
  • Poll closed .
stonz

stonz

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I think some discussion about the 7 freshmen would be a good diversion from the [Redacted] talk. We're about a quarter of the way through the year. We've played 3 home games, and we've been on national TV (if you count espnU), so it's time to go on the record.

We don't have the polling software for you to rank the seven 1-7, so just vote for the player you think will be the best college player.

To clarify:

This poll is NOT:
-Which freshman has played the best so far this year?
-Which freshman has the most potential?
-Which freshman will be drafted the highest?
-Which freshman do you like the best?
-Which freshman has been the most pleasant surprise?

This poll IS:
-Which freshman will have the best college career?

I plan on repeating this poll a few times over the next few years. There's a decent chance that the poll results become overwhelming, especially after a year or two. So, after voting, post your rankings, from 1 to 7. I'll tally results for everyone that posts a complete list. Hopefully provides us with some useful "Wisdom of the Crowds" takeaways.
 
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My list:
Rank) Name: Peak*
-Analysis

*Peak role is based on a NCAA Tournament team, slightly above average in the ACC. Think of our 09-10 team.

(For the tldr people:
1) McIntyre
2) Thomas
3) Rountree
4) Moto
5) Jones
6) Cavanaugh
7) Washington)

1) Codi: All-ACC Player
-Just as advertised. Athletic. Currently shooting well from 2, 3, and the line. As his shooting continues to improve, he will become near impossible to guard. Already posting a 103 ORtg, best among our starters. Solid rebounder for a guard. Has the tools to be a quality defender, but not there yet. On track to be a 4 year starter, who could peak as one of the best players in the conference.

2) Devin Thomas: Starter
-To this point, Devin has not displayed very much offensive efficiency (ORtg 89), but I think there is significant room for growth as he adjusts to this level. He has already shown the ability to get to the line...now he needs to develop his FT shooting. Early returns suggest he will be an excellent rebounder. Jury is out on his post defense.

3) Aaron Rountree: Fringe Starter / 6th Man
-I think it's safe to say that Rountree has been the most pleasant surprise of the frosh so far. He has been absurdly efficient (ORtg 125) offensively, and we all know how much of an impact he makes defensively (he is already posting elite block and steal numbers). Unfortunately, there is not a ton of upside until/unless he develops a jump shot. On a tournament quality team, I think Rountree is ideally a super-sub, first guy off the bench to provide a spark.

4) Arnaud Moto: Key Role Player
-Moto has been a mixed bag so far. How about these shooting #s: 2/4 from 3, and 6/18 from the line? Both will adjust as the sample size increases, but I think the 3 pt % might be more of a fluke; Moto is simply not much of a shooter right now. Luckily he takes most of his shots from around the rim. He has good rebounding numbers, and I expect him to become a high-quality defender. On a tournament quality team, I think Moto is likely a key role player, 6th or 7th man. Similar to Rountree, he could potentially be a starter if he was on a team where he had no pressure to score and could focus on defense.

5) Madison Jones: Backup PG
-For me, Madison has been a great surprise as well. He's shown surprising quickness (and dunking ability), and looks to be a crafty finisher around the rim. He might be our best on-ball defender right now. He really does a great job pressuring the ball. That said...he can't shoot. Of course all Wake Forest fans know that point guards don't necessarily need to be able to shoot from 3 (or the FT line), but it's extremely difficult to start on a tournament quality team considering those shortcomings. On a good team, I think Jones is a career backup, but a useful one at that.

6) Tyler Cavanaugh: Role Player?
-Of all the freshmen, Tyler is the one off to the most disappointing start. Yes, he missed the off-season with a foot injury. That is important to note, no doubt. But its hard to ignore what he's shown so far. His rebounding is very poor for a big man. His assists are low, and his turnovers are high. He doesn't block shots, and he doesn't create turnovers. Of course, that would all be fine if he was shooting well. But he isn't. 2/13 from 3 so far is pretty ugly. Obviously its a small sample, but the point is clear: (much like Chase,) Tyler must make a high % of shots from the perimeter, or he does not provide enough value to be on the court. I imagine his shooting will turn around; he was clearly a good shooter in high school. His confidence is likely very low right now. Unfortunately, even with quality perimeter shooting, I don't think Tyler will ever have a good enough all-around game to start on a tournament team.

7) Andre: Scout-team Star?
-Last almost by default; tough to evaluate since he's hardly played. The fact that he can't get minutes, considering how bad we are, should speak volumes. He is simply too raw to contribute right now. Any projection casting him as a future impact player is not much more than blind optimism, in my opinion. It's tough for me to envision him ever being able to contribute on a tournament-caliber team.

Overall, I think #1 is obvious, and I didn't have trouble figuring out who I'd put at 7 either. But 2-6 were pretty tough.

Points so far:
1) CMM: 7
2) Thomas: 6
3) Roun'three': 5
4) Moto: 4
5) Jones: 3
6) Cav: 2
7) NBDre: 1
 
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College career only?

CMM
Rountree
Jones
Thomas
Moto
Cavanaugh
Washington
 
I think Tree's ranking rests solely on if Bz is fired or not... If he isn't, Tree might end up being 2nd on my list since you can't teach his instincts. I think DT, Jones and Moto have more to offer once coached though.

Bz being fired will make them all better IMO, but the others will develop faster.

Codi is the best regardless. I voted him, although it could change depending if he leaves early or not.
 
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Which of our 7 freshmen will have the bet college basketball career?
Click to expand...

That depends on which one gets away from the Buzz the quickest.
 
CMM
Thomas
Tree
Jones
Moto
Cav
AW

Will be very interesting to see if CMM plays more as a 1 or 2 as his career at Wake continues. Also, under a different system and a new head coach (started to say better but really who wouldn't be better?), I think Thomas could develop nicely and really be a star. In terms of potential, I'm not sure the gap is as far as some think between him and CMM.
 
I think Cav will prove to be a good player as he develops. A lot of growing pains early on but he does a lot of good things off the ball.

Moto has a long way to go imo. He's got a lot of raw ability but needs to learn to foul less and make higher IQ plays.
 
I took this as the player that will have the best four years, not the best final year. So, I voted for Madison Jones. Not the popular choice, but so far he's been consistently good, and I think he'll work hard on his shot. He's also more athletic than I realized and just seems like a real high IQ player.

I have high hopes for all of them though, provided they have three years under a good coach.
 
Really like this topic. My order goes:

CMM
Moto
Tree
Thomas
Cav
Jones
Washington

-CMM is the clear #1. He's the most explosive athlete, has the ball in his hands every possession and has a scorer's mentality.
-I truly believe Moto is going to turn into an All-ACC defender and his post/mid-range game will continue to develop.
-I then rank Tree third because his versatility is just unbelievable. He will contribute in every basketball game he plays in even if he never gets dominant at one aspect of the game.
-I put Thomas 4th mostly because of how much I believe in Moto. I think moving forward Moto's versatility will allow him to be featured in the offense more and Thomas will get fewer looks inside. He also lacks Moto's explosiveness which clearly limits him from a defensive standpoint.
-I rank Cav 5 because even though Jones has been better so far, Cav doesn't have to play behind CMM. I think Cav's jumper will continue to develop and that will allow him to play solid minutes at the 3/4. He will be a nice pick and pop option moving forward.
-Jones is 6th because he has to play behind CMM, and it's pretty obvious that we're making a heavy push on targeting 2014 point guards.
-To me, it was even more obvious to put Andre last than it was to put Codi first. If he had redshirted a year, then you could've made a case for him not being last with an extra year of development. He's not strong enough to be dominant in a half court set, and he's not nearly fast enough to be a solid transition player. His conditioning is lackluster and his offensive game is far from polished.
 
CMM
Thomas
Tree
Moto
Cav
Jones
Dre

like everyone else, i'm most confident at the top and bottom of the list. granted i've only watched about 2.5 games worth of action, but i've been pleasantly by some little things i've seen from DT. echoing everyone else that tree has good instincts and can wreak havoc on a game. just think that his offensive upside may be limited.
 
CMM
Thomas
Moto
Tree
Cav
Jones
Washington
 
Going with Rountree. Loved what I saw from him in the Richmond game. But it's still so early.
 
I can't help but think that Moto is ultimately the best player on this roster.

Here's my list:

1. Arnaud - 6'6 defensive stopper is a spot-up perimeter game and some experience away from being Travis's best case comparison. I think we'll see significant improvement between years one and two. Whether he emerges as a pro prospect really isn't a question at this point - he simply has all of the characteristics of an indispensable college player and the potential to become a stud for us on both ends of the floor. He's obviously not in Josh Howard's league (yet), but I think he can be that kind of player if he capitalizes on his potential. And he's got four years to do it...

Projected career year: 17 ppg, 7 rpg, 2 apg, 2 spg, 2 bpg

2. Codi - I see Codi developing into a Justin Gray-type player, not much of a point guard, but a tremendous scorer who can play on or off of the ball. Unless he develops into an outstanding defender or morphs into a point guard, I don't think he'll have the opportunity to be more than a productive scorer and key facilitator of our offense - as he's not a point guard (I think his ceiling is somewhere between Justin Gray's senior year and CJ Harris's junior year [or for a non-Wake comparison: think Jack McClinton], rather than those of our pure PG's) - but, like Justin, he'll definitely get some looks as a pro.

Projected career year: 18 ppg, 2 rpg, 4 apg, 2 spg

3. Aaron - Others have pointed this out and call it cliche, but Aaron shows so many things that you just cannot teach. He has leaders' intangibles, a solid work ethic and a relentless in-game motor, shows awareness on both ends of the floor, and is focused on defense. This already positions him well to have a good college career. He's less physically gifted than Moto and really doesn't fit purely into the SF or PF position on offense at the moment, but he's going to have an awesome college career as a guy that every team needs. His ceiling is very high, but with all of these multi-faceted combo-forwards, it remains to be seen what his ultimate role and developmental trajectory will be.

Projected career year: 14 ppg, 8 rpg, 3 apg, 2 spg, 2 bpg

4. Andre - Andre's upside is through the roof and I really think that once he adds some strength, then he'll be the best center that's come through our program since Kyle and Eric graduated. You can't teach size, but more importantly, you can't teach size "heart." Andre has a long way to go, but simply being a mobile 7'0+ means that he has the potential to be special. At the very least, there's no doubt in my mind that he'll be better than Chas, Tony, or Ty.

Projected career year: 14 ppg, 9 rpg, 1 apg, 3 bpg

5. Devin - I think his upside is more limited than the above four, as he's not a physical specimen (average size, above average athlete), but he's going to be a really good college big man. I love that he earns his minutes on pure hustle. If his skills come along, then he could easily go higher, but our lack of a big man coach and recent troubles in developing bigs don't really suggest that he'll develop a ton given his limitations.

Projected career year: 12 ppg, 10 rpg, 1 apg, 1 spg, 1 bpg

6. Tyler - I love what he does and I stand by him even through his rough start, but he's just not as talented as the above guys and doesn't really possess any of their upside. What I do love is that he's an ideal player for a non-traditional offense (like the one that we run through CJ and Codi) given his versatility out of the pick-and-roll game and his shot will start falling eventually. What I don't like is that he hasn't been a very good rebounder or defender, and he hasn't shown much in the way of hustle to overcome his obvious physical limitations. It's early, but Cav strikes me as a guy whose ceiling is very low. He'll be useful, but not much more.

Projected career year: 8 ppg, 3 rpg, 2 apg, 1 spg

7. Madison - I love his heart and his hustle. I love his effort on defense. I love that we finally have a competent back-up point guard, but let's be honest...

Projected career year: 7 ppg, 2 rpg, 4 apg, 2 spg

If Daniel counted as a freshman, I'd put him between Devin and Tyler.
 
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I love the optimism and see some of the same traits you do in Moto. Directionally you may be right.....
but those stats aren't coming anywhere near fruition for most. Is that the absolute peak for each, or your expectation of what each should put up?

If you assume each player's career year occurs in their senior year, that's 90 points, 41 rebounds, and 8 blocks per game from these seven, assuming nothing else whatsoever is provided from the guys coming in behind them. I'll let you look up what kinds of numbers we put up, even the two years we reached #1. Hint, not those numbers.

I like the optimism. Just scale down a bit, considering that expecting those numbers is setting them up for collective failure.
 
Strickland33 said:
I can't help but think that Moto is ultimately the best player on this roster.

Here's my list:

1. Arnaud - 6'6 defensive stopper is a spot-up perimeter game and some experience away from being Travis's best case comparison. I think we'll see significant improvement between years one and two. Whether he emerges as a pro prospect really isn't a question at this point - he simply has all of the characteristics of an indispensable college player and the potential to become a stud for us on both ends of the floor. He's obviously not in Josh Howard's league (yet), but I think he can be that kind of player if he capitalizes on his potential. And he's got four years to do it...

Projected career year: 17 ppg, 7 rpg, 2 apg, 2 spg, 2 bpg

2. Codi - I see Codi developing into a Justin Gray-type player, not much of a point guard, but a tremendous scorer who can play on or off of the ball. Unless he develops into an outstanding defender or morphs into a point guard, I don't think he'll have the opportunity to be more than a productive scorer and key facilitator of our offense - as he's not a point guard (I think his ceiling is somewhere between Justin Gray's senior year and CJ Harris's junior year [or for a non-Wake comparison: think Jack McClinton], rather than those of our pure PG's) - but, like Justin, he'll definitely get some looks as a pro.

Projected career year: 18 ppg, 2 rpg, 4 apg, 2 spg

3. Aaron - Others have pointed this out and call it cliche, but Aaron shows so many things that you just cannot teach. He has leaders' intangibles, a solid work ethic and a relentless in-game motor, shows awareness on both ends of the floor, and is focused on defense. This already positions him well to have a good college career. He's less physically gifted than Moto and really doesn't fit purely into the SF or PF position on offense at the moment, but he's going to have an awesome college career as a guy that every team needs. His ceiling is very high, but with all of these multi-faceted combo-forwards, it remains to be seen what his ultimate role and developmental trajectory will be.

Projected career year: 14 ppg, 8 rpg, 3 apg, 2 spg, 2 bpg

4. Andre - Andre's upside is through the roof and I really think that once he adds some strength, then he'll be the best center that's come through our program since Kyle and Eric graduated. You can't teach size, but more importantly, you can't teach size "heart." Andre has a long way to go, but simply being a mobile 7'0+ means that he has the potential to be special. At the very least, there's no doubt in my mind that he'll be better than Chas, Tony, or Ty.

Projected career year: 14 ppg, 9 rpg, 1 apg, 3 bpg

5. Devin - I think his upside is more limited than the above four, as he's not a physical specimen (average size, above average athlete), but he's going to be a really good college big man. I love that he earns his minutes on pure hustle. If his skills come along, then he could easily go higher, but our lack of a big man coach and recent troubles in developing bigs don't really suggest that he'll develop a ton given his limitations.

Projected career year: 12 ppg, 10 rpg, 1 apg, 1 spg, 1 bpg

6. Tyler - I love what he does and I stand by him even through his rough start, but he's just not as talented as the above guys and doesn't really possess any of their upside. What I do love is that he's an ideal player for a non-traditional offense (like the one that we run through CJ and Codi) given his versatility out of the pick-and-roll game and his shot will start falling eventually. What I don't like is that he hasn't been a very good rebounder or defender, and he hasn't shown much in the way of hustle to overcome his obvious physical limitations. It's early, but Cav strikes me as a guy whose ceiling is very low. He'll be useful, but not much more.

Projected career year: 8 ppg, 3 rpg, 2 apg, 1 spg

7. Madison - I love his heart and his hustle. I love his effort on defense. I love that we finally have a competent back-up point guard, but let's be honest...

Projected career year: 7 ppg, 2 rpg, 4 apg, 2 spg

If Daniel counted as a freshman, I'd put him between Devin and Tyler.
Click to expand...

You have the sensational 7 averaging about 90 ppg with Bz's offensive sets? Nice. Highly improbable, but nice.
 
The idea of any of those guys besides CMM averaging 12+ points per game is ridiculous. It's more likely that CMM will average 30 and those other guys will chip in 7/game. But really, half of them are going to transfer anyway.
 
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