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At least 172 Palestinians killed, 1,280 injured, UN says 77% are civilians

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Much like Duke basketball, Israel hits more shots than their opponent attempts.
 
Those numbers are irrelevant. What would be relevant is who started the actions.

If you throw two punches at me, I can legitimately throw as many back at you as I can.
 
RJKarl said:
Those numbers are irrelevant. What would be relevant is who started the actions.

If you throw two punches at me, I can legitimately throw as many back at you as I can.
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an eye for 3000 darker eyes, right?
 
RJKarl said:
Those numbers are irrelevant. What would be relevant is who started the actions.

If you throw two punches at me, I can legitimately throw as many back at you as I can.
Click to expand...

No, you can't. And I don't think the Torah, and subsequent scholarship and doctrine, would validate that opinion, either.
 
RJKarl said:
Those numbers are irrelevant. What would be relevant is who started the actions.

If you throw two punches at me, I can legitimately throw as many back at you as I can.
Click to expand...

Let me consult the Torah to see who started what since this all dates back THOUSANDS OF YEARS.

You're acting like this is happening in a vacuum where the Arab-Israeli conflicts started when three Israeli teens disappeared and were murdered two weeks ago.

Also let's be clear that none of Hamas' rockets are landing. Israel has sirens, an iron dome to shoot down rockets, and know that Hamas is going to shoot rockets and missiles. Gaza has none of this. They may get a five minute warning from a leaflet before their house is destroyed.
 
RJKarl said:
Those numbers are irrelevant. What would be relevant is who started the actions.

If you throw two punches at me, I can legitimately throw as many back at you as I can.
Click to expand...

All those innocent men, women, and children that are being killed and wounded did not throw any punches at Israel, they're just trying to eke out an existence in Gaza and not get blown up.
 
It's like me standing on a deck at a party, pissing onto somebody who is standing under an umbrella and the person responds by shitting in their hand and flinging it into a crowded party. The person under the umbrella is never going to get wet even if it was my intention, while throwing your shit into a party is going to hit some people and both sides know that this is the case.

Israel knows they aren't in serious danger and yet they continue to bomb the shit out of an uncovered Gaza area.
 
RJKarl said:
Those numbers are irrelevant. What would be relevant is who started the actions.

If you throw two punches at me, I can legitimately throw as many back at you as I can.
Click to expand...

I mean I know the Stand Your Ground joke has already been made but that's exactly the mindset the bolded sentence described.

If you walk into someones home, declare it your own and that person throws two punches at you but misses, you think you are justified to beat the shit out of them?
 
And they are knowingly bombing civilians with little warning.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Let me consult the Torah to see who started what since this all dates back THOUSANDS OF YEARS.

You're acting like this is happening in a vacuum where the Arab-Israeli conflicts started when three Israeli teens disappeared and were murdered two weeks ago.

Also let's be clear that none of Hamas' rockets are landing. Israel has sirens, an iron dome to shoot down rockets, and know that Hamas is going to shoot rockets and missiles. Gaza has none of this. They may get a five minute warning from a leaflet before their house is destroyed.
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And it's incredibly disingenuous when Netanyahu and other defenders in this offensive say those boys were killed by Hamas.
It was clear from the beginning that the kidnappers weren’t acting on orders from Hamas leadership in Gaza or Damascus. Hamas’ Hebron branch — more a crime family than a clandestine organization — had a history of acting without the leaders’ knowledge, sometimes against their interests. Yet Netanyahu repeatedly insisted Hamas was responsible for the crime and would pay for it.
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So Netanyahu knew that the kidnapping wasn’t by Hamas proper, insisted that it was anyway, withheld the truth about the boys’ deaths in order to sustain a massive process of collective punishment of Palestinians in the West Bank, and then unleashed yet another brutal, lop-sided pulverization of Gaza. This is not a rational regime; and it is not a civilized government.
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And yes, yes, and yes again to the notion that Hamas should not be firing rockets into Israel at all, let alone at civilians directly, even though they have incurred no casualties and have bounced off the Iron Dome when they encroached too far into Israel proper. But in this instance, there is no equivalence. One side deliberately and deceptively instigated absolutely unjustified collective punishment of an entire population, and pre-meditatedly whipped up nationalistic and racist elements to back them up.
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http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2014/07/11/the-revenge-doctrine-ctd-2/
 
RJKarl said:
Those numbers are irrelevant. What would be relevant is who started the actions.

If you throw two punches at me, I can legitimately throw as many back at you as I can.
Click to expand...

:squint:

Who is it exactly providing this legitimacy?
 
you know, based on their behavior i'm not sure israel has the right to exist. it can't wield power like a grown up so maybe we'll have to give it a time out
 
RChildress107 said:
I mean I know the Stand Your Ground joke has already been made but that's exactly the mindset the bolded sentence described.

If you walk into someones home, declare it your own and that person throws two punches at you but misses, you think you are justified to beat the shit out of them?
Click to expand...

If someone invades my home and throws punches at me (as long as it's an adult), I have every right to beat the shit out of him.

SYG is about "perception" not actions.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Both sides believe that the other side is in their home.
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The person who is attacked has the right to defend himself. It's that simple.

Yes, there needs to be a Palestinian State. Yes, there needs to be an end to the blockade in Gaza. But also yes to the PA reigning in the murderers of Hamas.
 
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