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August 6, 2015 Debate(s?) -- OFFICIALY OFFICIAL DEBATE THREAD. CLICK HERE NOW!

DCDeac said:
The Fox move to destroy Trump is pretty fascinating. Piss him off and he could go 3rd party and end any chance of a GOP win, so it's pretty much a full-on game of chicken at this point.

Plus, do people really think Donald Trump wants to be President? Like, 4 years in office, doing the job of President every day? Ditching his private life and his business? I just don't see it. Now he gets to play the victim to the far right establishment attackers, build support across moderates on both sides - even if they don't actually want him to be President - and come out of this run as the popular voice of unbought reason. AND he alone holds the election in the balance.

At face value it seems like a horrible strategy by Fox and friends. Seems even worse based on the "gotcha" questions like bankruptcy that Trump made them look like idiots on.
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Carly Fiorina won the entire evening; every time I hear her speak I am far more impressed than any of the other 16 clowns out there last night.

And the above pasted post is dead on accurate.
 
Seems like Fox is in a catch-22 now.

Trump says if you treat him with respect, and he lost the nomination, he'd bow out and endorse whoever won. If you don't, he might run as a 3rd party candidate.

So Fox is in the position of having to treat him respectfully? Seems like either that or putting him in a corner could endear him to the far right.
 
Targeting him last night as Fox did was amateur hour but par for the course for Fox. I'm no Trump sympathizer but he got shafted. The first question was directly targeting him. Complete BS.
 
Hillary should just start funding Trump' campaign directly. If he wins the nomination, she wins. If he loses and runs third party, she wins in maybe the biggest landslide in history. She has got to be his biggest supporter now.
 
Fox sucks. These candidates suck. Trump is going to FSU and there's nothing the party can do about it. I enjoyed hearing Kasich and Carson speak, was ignorant on them before the debate. Hilary or Biden beat these clowns pretty easily. That's all I got.
 
 
Fuck Your Couch said:
Trump isn't a legit candidate to win the primary... c'mon. His support is high in a large group of candidates but his polarizing nature that gives him that support also isn't going to grow when the field pares down. This isn't the first time this has happened.
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Exactly. Nate Silver breaks down the Tunnels' favorite liberal myth.

I'd rank last night's performances something like this:

Rubio- Smooth, obviously well-prepared, gave good answers. Didn't like the dodge on the rape/mother's life abortion exception, but that won't hurt him with the base any.

Kasich- Thought his answers were the best, but he doesn't look as presidential as some of the others.

Christie- Shouldn't have gotten into it with Paul, but the SS answer might have been the best of the night.

Walker- Looks like a dweeb, but I was hoping he would self-destruct and he didn't. The Iran answer was one of the dumbest of the debate, but won't hurt him with the base any.

Bush- Started out weak, but got better as the night went on.

Trump- "Clown" seemed to be the consensus among friends who watched

Paul- Major disappointment. Too combative, and called himself a "different kind of Republican" after saying the exact same things as the rest all night.

Huckabee- Just drop out already

Cruz- Looks like one of the Little Rascals. I can picture him wearing overalls and a straw hat going around painting fences, or whatever the hell the Little Rascals did.

Carson- Clueless


Ultimately, I don't see anyone on stage last night winning the general election.
 
DCDeac said:
The Fox move to destroy Trump is pretty fascinating. Piss him off and he could go 3rd party and end any chance of a GOP win, so it's pretty much a full-on game of chicken at this point.

Plus, do people really think Donald Trump wants to be President? Like, 4 years in office, doing the job of President every day? Ditching his private life and his business? I just don't see it. Now he gets to play the victim to the far right establishment attackers, build support across moderates on both sides - even if they don't actually want him to be President - and come out of this run as the popular voice of unbought reason. AND he alone holds the election in the balance.

At face value it seems like a horrible strategy by Fox and friends. Seems even worse based on the "gotcha" questions like bankruptcy that Trump made them look like idiots on.
Click to expand...

Not sure about Fox, but talk radio (Rush, etc...) definitely benefit from Clinton or Obama in office. It's why Michael Moore disappeared after W left office. Trump's got to be good for Fox ratings. Fox & Friends is his primary media vehicle now. Fox has to know a third party run is a disaster, but at least they can go after HRC. Trump is like Rasputin, Fox can't kill him.
 
OldGoldBeard said:
Exactly. Nate Silver breaks down the Tunnels' favorite liberal myth.
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The time dilation piece is certainly true. It seems like a big deal now, but he has a long way to go.

Still, this does seem like a fringe case you can't compare to guys like Santorum, Huckabee, Buchanan, and Forbes. Nobody has to Google who Trump is, so the search trends bit is dumb.

I think he makes it at least past the winnowing stage (stage 4 of the article), and the party is going to have to offer him a lot to bow out. And it's not exactly like they want to offer him a cabinet position, right?
 
DeacWatcher said:
If most everyone in this country didn't get like a 1000 channels, would Fox News actually even exist? I mean I can think of maybe 1-2 folks that would actually purchase it as an a la carte. Man the mods for this debate were terrible and to basically go after Trump the way they did shows the GOP's desperation.
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Fox news ratings destroy CNN and MSNBC. It's not even close. Last weeks numbers http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2015/08/05/cable-news-ratings-for-tuesday-august-4-2015/442995/

Kasich won the debate, but DV7 won the night.
 
I'm not at all worried about Trump. This is a marathon. He has no real solutions to offer. His act will grow tiresome with everyone after a while. He won't run as a 3rd party candidate. Nobody will have to pay him off to leave the race. As others rise, he will fall off... his descent intensified by the dumb, angry things he'll say when he isn't getting attention anymore.

I actually think his presence and current popularity are helpful in that it gives people a reason to care about the GOP nomination process, as evidenced by the length of this thread and the wide variety of people that watched the debate last night. I realize a lot of you watched it to ridicule the candidates, but you still watched it.
 
TownieDeac said:
The time dilation piece is certainly true. It seems like a big deal now, but he has a long way to go.

Still, this does seem like a fringe case you can't compare to guys like Santorum, Huckabee, Buchanan, and Forbes. Nobody has to Google who Trump is, so the search trends bit is dumb.

I think he makes it at least past the winnowing stage (stage 4 of the article), and the party is going to have to offer him a lot to bow out. And it's not exactly like they want to offer him a cabinet position, right?
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What do you offer a guy with billions and who has no interest in a cabinet position whatsoever?
 
For non-Ohioans, here's a piece on Kasich's curtailment of women's abortion rights in Ohio. It is interesting, he doesn't even talk about it. But then the local papers will review his budget and see his defunding of various items:

"I think the thing that makes this surprising to people is he never talks about this," says Copeland of NARAL Ohio. "All you'll ever find is he says, 'I'm pro-life.' That's it. He wants do this on the down-low."

And in the last election's gubernatorial debates, Kasich would show up but would not even acknowledge his opponent existed, let alone was in the room standing next to him. He would just ignore him and anything he said:

"When Kasich was ran for re-election in 2014, he and his opponent Ed FitzGerald participated in a taped interview with the Cleveland Plain Dealer. FitzGerald asked the governor about the 2013 budget provision that prevented rape crisis counselors from letting victims know they have a legal right to an abortion. "Why was it important to have a piece of legislation that literally imposed a gag rule on rape crisis counselors?" FitzGerald asked. "Do you have a question?" Kasich replied. After some coaxing from the Plain Dealer, Kasich said he was pro-life except in instances of rape or incest, but refused to address the provision's effect on rape victims. Following the taping, Kasich's team tried to get the Plain Dealer to take the video down, saying the governor was unaware that he was being recorded."

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/07/wolf-sheeps-clothing-gov-kasichs-reproductive-rights-record
 
 
 
Just to be clear, we're talking about Social Security here and not THE SS, right? Can never be too sure with that panel.
 
Scariest thing for the GOP was the audience. Tickets weren't randomly distributed on a first come first serve basis. The people in the audience are well-connected parts of the machine. Hooting and hollering at some of that dumb shit won't cause any swing state moderates to view the GOP any more favorably.

GOP needed to weed out Bachmann, Cain, and Santorum in 2012 and they need to weed out Trump, Carson, Cruz, and Huckabee now. Wingnuts have marginalized the party since 1992. They've got to go and can't believe it's gone on for so long.
 
I think Christie would have better success in a smaller debate where he has more time to speak and differentiate himself a bit. Not sure he lasts that long, though. And where as Kasich was appealing to moderates/dems for appearing to be not as conservative, Christie is actually more moderate than anyone on that stage last night.

I don't think there is enough moderate support in the Republican party for Bush, Christie, and Kasich to all stay in the race for the long haul. I'd like to be wrong on that, because I think any of them would have a decent shot to beat Hillary. Worried that Bush has too much financial support for Christie or Kasich to make any kind of run... And he's probably my least favorite of the 3.
 
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