• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

The Difference Between Liberalism & Leftism

That's not a specific answer to the question posed -- what is your solution other than electing more Republicans?
 
Seems like something that could be fixed with overturning Citizens United then primarying some of the politicians that are deepest in the pocket of special interests.

Doesn't match up with the rhetoric of "death machine" and replacing the whole system. That radical language suggests communist revolution not returning to a more labor friendly FDR style democracy.
 
The funny thing is that the far right of American politics understands how to get control of the system much better than the far left. You infiltrate the system from the inside and slowly steer in your direction. It takes 20-30 years, but you get your Donald Trump in the end.

If you want to shift the Democratic Party to the left, you'd do well to study how the Republican Party was shifted so far to the right in the last quarter century.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
A very naive and reductive take common from the people claiming to be "realists". How many of these people in the black do you believe have historically received "4 slices" of whatever it is they need, as opposed to say, experiencing the greatest income inequality since the gilded age. A real pragmatic would realize that many if not most people are disenfranchised and abandoned by the back and forth give and take incrementalism.
Click to expand...

I'm not talking about what anyone has historically received, I'm talking about general elections under the current system. I voted for Bernie but I sure as fuck wasn't going to sit on the sideline (even in a blue state) and twiddle my thumbs while the country elected an unqualified idiot, nor was I going to go cast a throwaway vote for Jill Stein, Gary Johnson, or write in Bernie.

I don't disagree with many of the policies you support and am personally far left of Hillary and nearly all "centrist democrats" but the reality of our electoral system is that the two parties wield a disproportionate amount of power (for both systemic and practical reasons).

If you're arguing that Democrats and progressives need to do a better job of promoting progressives throughout the primary process to ensure that the ultimate nominee is not a centrist Democrat then you're preaching to the choir. If you're arguing that once the general election rolls around, if the former has not worked and a centrist is the Democratic nominee, that progressives should stay home or vote third party as a show of dislike or disdain for both major party nominees, I would suggest this is a waste of time.
 
Not to mention that plenty of areas on that map represent Republicans/conservatives who weren't pleased with Donald as the nominee. I mean in Massachusetts the big gray blob appears to be predominantly Worcester County which sure as hell isn't any bastion of progressives.

It also represents people who are apathetic to the entire political process.
 
vadimivich said:
The funny thing is that the far right of American politics understands how to get control of the system much better than the far left. You infiltrate the system from the inside and slowly steer in your direction. It takes 20-30 years, but you get your Donald Trump in the end.

If you want to shift the Democratic Party to the left, you'd do well to study how the Republican Party was shifted so far to the right in the last quarter century.
Click to expand...
Not typical of you to post such a stupid take. The "far right" of American politics is extremely wealthy, influential, and their beliefs coalesce with nationalism. In what way, at all, is that similar to the "far left"? Turns out there is a big fucking difference between opposing institutional wealth and opposing illegal immigration.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Not to mention that plenty of areas on that map represent Republicans/conservatives who weren't pleased with Donald as the nominee. I mean in Massachusetts the big gray blob appears to be predominantly Worcester County which sure as hell isn't any bastion of progressives.

It also represents people who are apathetic to the entire political process.
Click to expand...
The vast majority of people who don't vote are younger, felons, and/or lower income. Not mathematically sound for you to assume their potential voting patterns based on geography.
 
ImTheCaptain said:
sounds like you know how to win, you just don't want to admit it
Click to expand...
Nothing is going to change in this country until suburb Democrats start voting for the most progressive candidates. Your influence is outsized based on your taxes, spending power, and voting participation. When you start using your votes to advocate for the disefranchised poor then the establishment will move left. Leftists are not going to split the vote with a third party and take the blame for Republican control.
 
ah yes, the everyone is a Republican unless they're not assumption/accusation
 
ImTheCaptain said:
ah yes, the everyone is a Republican unless they're not assumption/accusation
Click to expand...
Not what I said. Democratic primaries are the greatest obstacle for liberal populism in this country. Democratic primaries are overwhelming controlled by special interests and older, more conservative voters
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
Lets be specific. African Americans, whom Democrats claim to have the best interests of, lost HALF their wealth in the great recession and subprime mortgage crisis. The subprime mortgage crisis could have been prevented if Glass Steagal had not been repealed by the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act (signed into law by Bill Clinton). Black Americans to this day have not recovered their lost wealth.

Just recently, 17 Democrat Senators voted for the CRAPO bill to neuter the Dodd-Frank Wall St reform act which was passed in fucking reaction to the mortgage crisis. A specific portion of the CRAPO bill blocks the CFBP from collecting data on racial profiling and discrimination in predatory loans, you know those discriminatory toxic loans which helped cause African Americans to lose 50% of their goddamned wealth.

When I posted my outrage about this on this board of pragmatic, moderate liberals I got a big fucking "meh" along with "compromise is good" and "investment banks are constituents too!" If you shallow, surface level starbucks liberals are the pragmatic incrementalists, then double fuck pragmatism. You have no fucking clue.
Click to expand...

The reality is in this country all Americans have two choice in politics -Dems or Reps. If you can't see how much more Dems have done and are doing for blacks in our nation, then you can't be taken seriously.

If you split Dems, you give free reign to the GOP to turn back civil rights dramatically.
 
RJKarl said:
The reality is in this country all Americans have two choice in politics -Dems or Reps. If you can't see how much more Dems have done and are doing for blacks in our nation, then you can't be taken seriously.

If you split Dems, you give free reign to the GOP to turn back civil rights dramatically.
Click to expand...

350px-US_incarceration_timeline-clean.svg.png


And he wrote the 1994 Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act signed by President Clinton. Black Lives Matter activists want Hillary Clinton to answer for her role, as First Lady, in that set of policies. But her role was tangential compared to Biden’s. “Let me define the liberal wing of the Democratic Party,” he said in a 1994 debate with Sen. Orrin Hatch. “The liberal wing of the Democratic Party is now for 60 new death penalties … the liberal wing of the Democratic Party is for 100,000 cops. The liberal wing of the Democratic Party is for 125,000 new state prison cells.”
Click to expand...
 
I seem to recall a lot of "woke" liberals on this board lamenting the death of Marielle Franco. It's great that you can whitewash her and co-opt her message for your neoliberalism, and then deny the existence or political positions of black leftists in your own country. See also, the whitewashing of Martin Luther King.
 
RJKarl said:
The reality is in this country all Americans have two choice in politics -Dems or Reps. If you can't see how much more Dems have done and are doing for blacks in our nation, then you can't be taken seriously.

If you split Dems, you give free reign to the GOP to turn back civil rights dramatically.
Click to expand...
You must have missed where I just told you that 17 Dems voted to basically allow banks to target African Americans with toxic sub prime loans. Republicans have the presidency and congress despite the heroism of Democratic ghouls like Joe Manchin & Heidi Heitkamp. So please stop with the dumbass hysterics. You aren't preventing the erosion of civil rights, you're just using a straight ticket vote as an excuse to ignore civil rights being taken away.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
It definitely isn't. Don't be dense. I know damn well you're familiar with the demographics of voting participation.
Click to expand...

Sure so push voting participation but don’t withhold your own vote from the better candidate out of spite. Perfect is the enemy of good.
 
MHBDemon said:
I seem to recall a lot of "woke" liberals on this board lamenting the death of Marielle Franco. It's great that you can whitewash her and co-opt her message for your neoliberalism, and then deny the existence or political positions of black leftists in your own country. See also, the whitewashing of Martin Luther King.
Click to expand...

Link?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top