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2020 Presidential Election: Biden v. Trump

ConnorEl said:
Rubish hatred of them "elites" [northerners in the case of the south] a'tellin' them whut to do is a pow'rful drug.


Lots of this attitude still lingers in the south. Republicans tapped into this decades ago.


The conservative disinformation mediasphere then paved the way for a conman demagogue like Trump.
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If you think that "don't tread on me" streak is merely a Southern thing, you obviously have not spent much time driving around the country.
 
DeacMan said:
Assuming he loses how quickly will the GOP pivot away from him. It will be head snapping. Those who have tied their wagon to his car the hardest will be ruined.
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lol

he'll be rehabbed by the media + dems before 2028, same as W has been
 
TownieDeac said:
lol

he'll be rehabbed by the media + dems before 2028, same as W has been
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man i don't know on this one. and i don't think he'll carry himself in a way that will allow people to rehab him. W just kinda went away, Trump ain't gonna do that.

that said, i agree it's pretty surprising that everyone has conveniently "re-remembered" the W era. Trump was the greatest thing that ever happened to his reputation and honestly Barry took it pretty easy on him.
 
I am assuming the media just wants to drive clicks and traffic as there have been way too many, the polls could be wrong again (by a 3x factor than last time and ignore any adjustment made), and the race may be tightening if you flip this poll on its side and align it just right with the sun. Like PA is between 5-7 points for Biden, the same as South Carolina's 5-7 points for Trump, and nobody in their right mind thinks Biden will even come close to winning SC. Along with hedging by forecasters, like if you are so scared that your job is dependent on the results of something you are trying to model and you don't believe in your model then you shouldn't be in modeling.
 
TownieDeac said:
lol

he'll be rehabbed by the media + dems before 2028, same as W has been
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Some politicians never get that treatment, see LBJ and Nixon as examples. And Trump is a few steps past them. Carter and Bush II managed to get it despite being viewed very poorly by the electorate when they left office. But it took time.
 
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ConnorEl said:
From the perspective of the rural south, northerners were collectively so from civil war times.

This has morphed into “elites” from cities, academia, and non- conservative media sources.
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I didn't really "morph." Resentment of northerners was only about people from the north coming down to fight against slavery and then after the Civil War people coming to enforce Reconstruction. They've never really had a problem with wealthy con men, plantation owners, politicians, or otherwise. Poor white people in the south have always chosen racism over class consciousness.
 
Henry Chinaski said:
man i don't know on this one. and i don't think he'll carry himself in a way that will allow people to rehab him. W just kinda went away, Trump ain't gonna do that.

that said, i agree it's pretty surprising that everyone has conveniently "re-remembered" the W era. Trump was the greatest thing that ever happened to his reputation and honestly Barry took it pretty easy on him.
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I do remember the left propping up Pat Buchanan in the mid aughts to go after W. That was weird. One of two things would have to happen for them to rehab Trump
1)The 2028 pub candidate would have to be worse than Trump. That's a tall order, but never underestimate the depth the GOP will sink to.
2)The 2028 pub candidate would be in a close race and be sharply criticized by Trump. It would be pretty embarrassing for our side if it happens for this reason.
 
DeacMan said:
Assuming he loses how quickly will the GOP pivot away from him. It will be head snapping. Those who have tied their wagon to his car the hardest will be ruined.
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They can’t. The base loves the guy. They’re running cars off the road and freezing to death for the man. That’s not going to change because of an election they are told was stolen from him. Just look at guys like Rubio and Cruz sucking him off aster the way he treated them in the campaign. Trump didn’t just happen to the gop. The voters demanded him.
 
deactherunner said:
I do remember the left propping up Pat Buchanan in the mid aughts to go after W. That was weird. One of two things would have to happen for them to rehab Trump
1)The 2028 pub candidate would have to be worse than Trump. That's a tall order, but never underestimate the depth the GOP will sink to.
2)The 2028 pub candidate would be in a close race and be sharply criticized by Trump. It would be pretty embarrassing for our side if it happens for this reason.
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Trump has more then decent odds of being dead in 8 years. He's going to be viewed as the worst President in the lifetime of anyone breathing. The GOP is going to pivot so hard away from him on a personal level if he loses it will make your head spin. The bigger risk is who replaces him on their side. Bc rebuilding a base out of the ashes of this mess is not an easy order. On the Dem side it will be reading too much into what beating him actually means for what the greater electorate wants; which right now doesn't seem like much of a risk. Biden isn't running on big ideas. He's running on dealing with Covid so we can then fix the economy and restoring normalcy and decency. That's pretty basic stuff.
 
DeacMan said:
Trump has more then decent odds of being dead in 8 years. He's going to be viewed as the worst President in the lifetime of anyone breathing. The GOP is going to pivot so hard away from him on a personal level if he loses it will make your head spin. The bigger risk is who replaces him on their side. Bc rebuilding a base out of the ashes of this mess is not an easy order. On the Dem side it will be reading too much into what beating him actually means for what the greater electorate wants; which right now doesn't seem like much of a risk. Biden isn't running on big ideas. He's running on dealing with Covid so we can then fix the economy and restoring normalcy and decency. That's pretty basic stuff.
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They tried to pivot away from him in 2012 with their introspective deep dive. He represents what a majority of pub voters actually want.
 
Deacfreak07 said:
They tried to pivot away from him in 2012 with their introspective deep dive. He represents what a majority of pub voters actually want.
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Republicans already suffered a huge election defeat in 2018 mostly because of Trump. The party has become even more loyal to Trump as a result. Republicans who have distanced themselves from Trump since then have been excommunicated.
 
DeacMan said:
No. But they'll watch the Trump news network (hence the attacks on Fox). I'm only half kidding.

This guy noted Trump could lose the popular vote but win the election last go round. And he's got access to district level polling that says the same warning signs for Clinton from that data don't exist this go round.

https://twitter.com/Redistrict/status/1322910480604794881
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I've wondered if that is why Fox is so invested in the Hunter Biden "scandel". Fear is good for them, so normally democrats in charge is good for their ratings. However, they may feel they really need Trump to be reelected so that he doesn't become their competition.
 
Deacfreak07 said:
They can’t. The base loves the guy. They’re running cars off the road and freezing to death for the man. That’s not going to change because of an election they are told was stolen from him. Just look at guys like Rubio and Cruz sucking him off aster the way he treated them in the campaign. Trump didn’t just happen to the gop. The voters demanded him.
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Yeah, that really isn't how it works. Politicians are not stupid. So long as he's the President its a fucking silly dance for a lot of these guys. The GOP has a tent that Trump has shrunk. They know this. So they play to Trump now because they have to while putting enough stakes in the ground to distinguish themselves from him later. And how much each politician does this to a large degree contingent on a host of factors related to how they calculate maintaining their own job. As soon as it is hip to distance from Trump they'll all become more vocal. Some of these guys will be battling to become a standard bearer and to do that they all know the tent can't keep getting smaller. So . . .

Marco Rubio - Licks Trump's boots at a campaign rally

Also Marco Rubio - but just one example - Demands Trump be transparent about his Covid diagnosis for the good of the nation. Sounds silly but they all have to have green shoots of how they were critical to build any legitimacy.

Mitch McConnell - Pushes along Coney-Barrett in lock step with the President

Also Mitch McConnell - "I have not even been to the White House since Mid-August"

Very few of them are more stridently outspoken - Romney, that dude from Nebraska, etc. More of them will be shortly if he loses.
 
Tobacco Road said:
I've wondered if that is why Fox is so invested in the Hunter Biden "scandel". Fear is good for them, so normally democrats in charge is good for their ratings. However, they may feel they really need Trump to be reelected so that he doesn't become their competition.
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Yeah, wouldn't shock me. Trump is all about his "brand". Would be interesting to see if it goes down in flames (or rather how quickly it does). Cable TV news isn't exactly lucrative these days. Some of the hosts these days get about as many viewers nightly as a Brady Bunch re-run in the Omaha market (yes, I'm aware that's a an exaggeration).
 
PhDeac said:
Republicans already suffered a huge election defeat in 2018 mostly because of Trump. The party has become even more loyal to Trump as a result. Republicans who have distanced themselves from Trump since then have been excommunicated.
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Part of the problem for the GOP is that they didn't get as large an electoral defeat as was expected. They got smoked in the house. But they gained in the senate, in large part because so many Dems in the Senate were up in normally red or purple states.

And we all get that Trump likes to cut anyone off at the knees who goes against his will. If he loses that all changes very quickly. You'll have a party trying to redefine itself. How much time that takes will hinge a lot more on how the Dems play things (where do they give the GOP breathing room to carve out positions that paint the Dems as out of touch with popular opinion) vs. anything Trump does once he's gone.

Want to know what really fucks the GOP. It's Trump getting re-elected.
 
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