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Banning Critical Race Theory

It’s honestly kind of amazing how literally every conservative argument against public school eventually points to blaming teachers unions defending bad teachers and poor unmarried black people having children. The bedrock principles of American conservativism: anti labor, racism

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That fiscally conservative socially liberal bit is such horseshit.

remember, jhmd is motivated by a singular objective - spend as little as possible on taxes. He engineers his entire belief system and philosophy around this end.

It’s also interesting that these people are fine with inundating children as young as 3 and 4 with gun/firearm imagery and culture, cops and robbers in shootouts, etc. violence and death. But goddamn if they are going to let their kids read about two women or two men in love or that people with brown skin built this entire country at the end of those gun barrels.
 
birdman said:
Funny post, but it's not amazing and no one is ignoring performance metrics, we differ on how to fix them. We, you vs the rest of us, have different reasons for the underling performance failures. It is a simple matter of differing conceptions of how the system works and responds to inputs. We believe that something very valuable is worth investing more time, money, and effort in, you believe that if something isn't working you should divert the time, money, and effort to a different system that might work better. We believe that the reason things aren't working effectively is that they have been underfunded and need more investment, you believe that we've been investing in the system for decades and it has proven to fail so why throw good money after bad. I think those are both legit hypotheses and valid perspectives and the data are confusing and mixed as to which perspective is correct. Holding one perspective vs the other doesn't make someone stupid or careless, just means we have different perspectives.
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Funny how compassionate conservatives believe public school is not meeting its objectives and should be defunded. What metrics make modern policing effective/successful and require growing investment every year?
 
birdman said:
Funny post, but it's not amazing and no one is ignoring performance metrics, we differ on how to fix them. We, you vs the rest of us, have different reasons for the underling performance failures. It is a simple matter of differing conceptions of how the system works and responds to inputs. We believe that something very valuable is worth investing more time, money, and effort in, you believe that if something isn't working you should divert the time, money, and effort to a different system that might work better. We believe that the reason things aren't working effectively is that they have been underfunded and need more investment, you believe that we've been investing in the system for decades and it has proven to fail so why throw good money after bad. I think those are both legit hypotheses and valid perspectives and the data are confusing and mixed as to which perspective is correct. Holding one perspective vs the other doesn't make someone stupid or careless, just means we have different perspectives.
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It is telling that his party's strategy for the police and military is to throw more money at the problem without any performance metrics.

ETA: Well, crap. I left the page open to do something else before writing my comment. Seems we are thinking the same thing.
 
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WakeandBake said:
They go hand in hand.
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Yeah. We can spend on education to uplift children and families or spend on policing to extract money from people and trap them in a pipeline to prison and legal slavery. Conservatives choose legal slavery every time.
 
deaconson said:
Funny how compassionate conservatives believe public school is not meeting its objectives and should be defunded. What metrics make modern policing effective/successful and require growing investment every year?
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Tobacco Road said:
It is telling that his party's strategy for the police and military is to throw more money at the problem without any performance metrics.

ETA: Well, crap. I left the page open to do something else before writing my comment. Seems we are thinking the same thing.
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Yeah the inconsistency in the preferred action (i.e., more funding vs redirected funding) is a bit frustrating across issues. Though, to be fair, they could make the same gripe about the left.
 
Republicans want public schools to fail. So they defund, add layers of bureaucracy and red tape, devote resources to accountability regimes, tear down unions, frustrate labor, and build up private alternatives.

Republicans want policing to succeed so they increase budgets, reduce bureaucracy and red tape, deemphasize accountability, bolster union, treat labor as heroes, and make sure no private alternatives can emerge.

Democrats should learn from this and “reform” policing similar to how Republicans and neoliberal Democrats have embraced “education reform.”
 
PhDeac said:
Republicans want public schools to fail. So they defund, add layers of bureaucracy and red tape, devote resources to accountability regimes, tear down unions, frustrate labor, and build up private alternatives.

Republicans want policing to succeed so they increase budgets, reduce bureaucracy and red tape, deemphasize accountability, bolster union, treat labor as heroes, and make sure no private alternatives can emerge.

Democrats should learn from this and “reform” policing similar to how Republicans and neoliberal Democrats have embraced “education reform.”
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I love your spirit here, but in regards to policing, “Democrats” vs “neoliberal Democrats” is a distinction without a difference. “Defund” is a non-starter and “reform” is just a synonym for increasing a budget with toothless stipulations.
 
Education reform is not increasing a budget with toothless stipulations.
 
PhDeac said:
Republicans want public schools to fail. So they defund, add layers of bureaucracy and red tape, devote resources to accountability regimes, tear down unions, frustrate labor, and build up private alternatives.

Republicans want policing to succeed so they increase budgets, reduce bureaucracy and red tape, deemphasize accountability, bolster union, treat labor as heroes, and make sure no private alternatives can emerge.

Democrats should learn from this and “reform” policing similar to how Republicans and neoliberal Democrats have embraced “education reform.”
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This is so dumb it doesn't merit a response. What a bizarre make-believe world you live in.
 
ChrisL68 said:
You can argue about unions, but the other two highlighted statements are pretty self-evident.
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The make-believe fantasy that conservatives want schools to fail is so strange. Why? What possible benefit do conservatives derive from people continuing to suffer from these failures? It's not a serious position (and thus popular here).
 
WokeandBroke said:
The make-believe fantasy that conservatives want schools to fail is so strange. Why? What possible benefit do conservatives derive from people continuing to suffer from these failures? It's not a serious position (and thus popular here).
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is this the pivot?
 
He almost has it figured out, replace conservative with wealthy ruling class and try again.
 
Actions have consequences. Continue to defund schools, ban books, ban lessons on difficult subjects in favor of parents teaching those at home <narrator- they won't because the conversations are difficult>.

Explain to me again the difference between saying you are for something and doing exactly the opposite at every opportunity.
 
PhDeac said:
Education reform is not increasing a budget with toothless stipulations.
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My point was that you can’t really analogize public education to policing because Democrats and Republicans agree on policing.
 
deaconson said:
Actions have consequences. Continue to defund schools, ban books, ban lessons on difficult subjects in favor of parents teaching those at home <narrator- they won't because the conversations are difficult>.

Explain to me again the difference between saying you are for something and doing exactly the opposite at every opportunity.
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Who is defunding schools? What I want is to tie the money to the student, rather than the teacher. If the student sees a public option that meets their needs, the funding should follow their choice (within the closed universe of public options). The amount of money allocated to public schools would remain completely unchanged, but would be allocated within the public system based on the choices of the stakeholders, rather than the bureaucrats.
 
WokeandBroke said:
Who is defunding schools? What I want is to tie the money to the student, rather than the teacher. If the student sees a public option that meets their needs, the funding should follow their choice (within the closed universe of public options). The amount of money allocated to public schools would remain completely unchanged, but would be allocated within the public system based on the choices of the stakeholders, rather than the bureaucrats.
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That already happens, at least in our district. Funding is based on the number of students enrolled.
 
Tobacco Road said:
That already happens, at least in our district. Funding is based on the number of students enrolled.
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Assuming the students in that district have true choice, then that system achieves the efficiencies that will let the best options attract the most funding.
 
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