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10,000 hours to be a pro golfer?

GreenDeac

GreenDeac

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http://www.tampabay.com/features/can-a-complete-novice-become-a-golf-pro-with-10000-hours-of-practice/1159357

"Could he stop being one thing and start being another? Could he, an average man, 5 feet 9 and 155 pounds, become a pro golfer, just by trying? Dan's not doing an experiment. He is the experiment.

The Dan Plan will take six hours a day, six days a week, for six years. He is keeping diligent records of his practice and progress. People who study expertise say no one has done quite what Dan is doing right now."



This guy is testing out Malcom Gladwell (and others) theory that 10,000 hours spent practicing a discipline can turn you into an expert. Pretty good article. There is pretty much no chance this guy makes the PGA Tour, but if he sticks with it, it will be really interesting to see what the results are.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Plenty of people have played golf for 10,000 hours and aren't on the PGA tour.
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Obviously. That's not really the point of the article though. He's literally starting from scratch, working his way back from the hole and approaching it as a full-time job. How many people have done that?
 
This type of thing happens all the time. How do you think people become specialists in medicine. You can't become a brain surgeon in a day...

It will be very interesting to see how it goes from a golf perspective. It could turn out he's just a shitty athlete and his "roof" is too low.
 
IIRC 10,000 hours is where the quasi-scientific line for being an expert begins, no matter what the task
 
The Stig said:
IIRC 10,000 hours is where the quasi-scientific line for being an expert begins, no matter what the task
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Yep. It's been show in some research and Malcom Gladwell covered the idea in his book Outliers.
 
The only thing I do which is somewhat competitive is some amateur on-track racecar driving. I think with 10,000 hours of practice I could become a serviceable pro driver (like I would make the field more often than not; finish in the top 25% of a pro field maybe 1 or 2 out of 10 races).
 
I completely missed that in your post the first time. Sorry bout that
 
The Stig said:
I completely missed that in your post the first time. Sorry bout that
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No worries, pretty interesting read if you get a chance.


I think this argument sheds light on the athlete vs. skill debate. There are some sports that very few of us could be experts in even with 10,000 hours of practice. Football, Basketball, Baseball, Hockey, I doubt the majority of people on here could be experts in those sports without beginning with a pretty high level of innate athletic ability.

Golf, billiards, darts, bowling - sports that are more about skill than being a true athlete, would be much easier to master with 10,000 hours of practice.
 
Color me really interested for this test of the 10,000 hypothesis.

At first I thought he might have missed the "deliberate" part of deliberate practice, but it seems like he's working closely with a swing coach.

I give him a decent shot of making at least a lower level tour.
 
GreenDeac said:
No worries, pretty interesting read if you get a chance.


I think this argument sheds light on the athlete vs. skill debate. There are some sports that very few of us could be experts in even with 10,000 hours of practice. Football, Basketball, Baseball, Hockey, I doubt the majority of people on here could be experts in those sports without beginning with a pretty high level of innate athletic ability.

Golf, billiards, darts, bowling - sports that are more about skill than being a true athlete, would be much easier to master with 10,000 hours of practice.
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Depends on what you mean by "expert" I could practice football for 10000 solid hours and not make the NFL.

I could study football for 10000 solid hours and make myself into an expert on schemes and strategy.

Same with the golf guy. After 10000 hours of practice will he be able to make the PGA tour? Depends partly on his innate talent. After 10000 hours of practice and study, however, I feel like he would have a really good shot at being an expert in swing mechanics, how to direct the trajectory of a golf shot, how to read a green, etc.
 
Dented said:
The only thing I do which is somewhat competitive is some amateur on-track racecar driving. I think with 10,000 hours of practice I could become a serviceable pro driver (like I would make the field more often than not; finish in the top 25% of a pro field maybe 1 or 2 out of 10 races).
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No doubt, but that field is a very limited field because of the economics it takes (I assume it takes a lot of money to get to a certain level, then you get sponsored) to become a driver and you're not competing against as large of a field. But for golf and any other "popular" sport I think "natural" ability plays into because so many people play the sport. You can also be an expert golfer and not be a pro golfer. The butch harmon's of the world didn't really cut it on the tour but know as much about a golf swing as you can know.
 
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Yep. There are some GREAT golfers that could keep up with the tour pros on any given round in private, but can't play consistently well in front of crowds. Stagefright. I wonder if that will be part of his training as well.
 
He has no chance of making any tour where they pay you money to play golf.

What does he think the already-advanced golfers who want to play on those tours are doing? Sure, he is putting in 6 hours a day. They are putting in 3 or 4 or maybe even 6 hours a day, and they can already break par, something he may never accomplish in his life. If he has been doing this for a year, only practicing short game, and is still blading chip shots across the green every few shots, he has no chance.

You can't just "practice golf" for 10,000 hours - there are so many variables that you have to learn with stance, course conditions, weather, etc. Then, not to mention that you may go a month without hitting a full swing 5-iron in actual play, but you need to be able to do it that one time it is important.

He could become a student of the game, but this compartmentalized approach to the game sort of goes against this happening. He may become a short game expert or something along those lines. No way will he become a professional golfer.
 
When he gets to about 3,000 hours left he's going to quit, because he will not be close.

There are guys who were professional golfers for multiple years, then fell apart and put in 10,000 hours but never made it back to winning competitions.

The error in his logic is the idea of being a novice, and the definition of golf. Professional golfers are probably, from a research perspective, experts in striking the ball, experts in handling pressure, experts in reading greens and conditions, and about a dozen other things. Outliers in sports are unique because of a combination of skills.

It might make more sense to try something with less components... Like kicking a football. Spend 10,000 kicking field goals all day and see if you can make an NFL team. Or darts. Just try to throw bulls-eyes for 10,000 hours. See how that works out.
 
What do you think his hopes or thoughts on the end product are?

If he becomes successful and plays professional golf, that is awesome as he is now making a living golfing. However, after treating golf like a job for 10,000 hours, will he still want to play?

If he is not successful but completes the 10,000 hours, is he successful in disproving this famous scientific theory? Seems like that's a pretty big deal...
 
I read Gladwell's book, and my recollection is that it isn't merely the 10,000 hours that makes one an "outlier." It is the innate ability COUPLED with the 10,000 hours that creates the POSSIBILITY of being an outlier.

Example: there are actually lots of people Bill Gates age who had his level of intelligence and interest in computer science. But at that time in history, very, very few had access to computer time. He did, and as such, became an outlier.

Taking a random person and giving them 10,000 hours of something does not create an outlier. It creates a person who has dedicated 10,000 hours to something.
 
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