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Conference Expansion: Stanford, California and SMU Join the ACC

spritethr said:
I don't think I would've given Wake as much consideration as I did if it wasn't P5. At that point, why not just go to UNC or State? Or Davidson like dixie brought up? Probably shallow on my part, but there's a handful of schools I didn't consider as much because a lack of athletics.
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P5 put Wake ahead of William and Mary for me.
 
deacdixieboy said:
I think this really depends on area of the country tbh. I went to grad school at several of the schools in your category. In the south, outside of Emory, it’s difficult to find an elite academic institution without D1 athletics (Davidson is D1). We go to being just another one of those schools listed, and honestly not as good as most of them on paper, if we don’t have P5 athletics. There is little to differentiate us in that case.
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Davidson is D1 but they don't give athletic scholarships. And they don't play P5, or even FBS, football. I would put Rice, Washington & Lee, Tulane, Richmond, William & Mary, etc. in the south category without P5 sports.
 
I feel really confident in saying:
1. I wouldn’t have considered Wake if it wasn’t P5.
2. My dad wouldn’t have known what Wake was or that it was even a school if he wasn’t reading about and watching Tim Duncan et al, seeing our campus on TV for games during that time and hearing the school hyped up during NCAA tournament, etc., and wouldn’t have let me go.
3. I know many other students in the NE in similar positions during that time.
4. If sports didn’t matter in selecting a college in terms of atmosphere, there are loads of other excellent small schools in the Northeast that all of the New England, NY, and NJ kids would attend instead. I say this knowing some people would love that.
 
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awakegirl said:
I feel really confident in saying:
1. I wouldn’t have considered Wake if it wasn’t P5.
2. My dad wouldn’t have known what Wake was or that it was even a school if he wasn’t reading about and watching Tim Duncan et al, seeing our campus on TV for games during that time and hearing the school hyped up during NCAA tournament, etc., and wouldn’t have let me go.
3. I know many other students in the NE in similar positions during that time.
4. If sports didn’t matter in selecting a college in terms of atmosphere, there are loads of other excellent small schools in the Northeast that all of the New England, NY, and NJ kids would attend instead. I say this knowing some people would love that.
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No doubt all of that is true. But we're reading a message board about Wake sports - we're an incredibly skewed group. I took tours of Wake, Emory, Duke, UNC, Davidson, etc. - in those tour groups it was eye opening how little applicants and their parents cared or even knew about sports.

As we have said, Wake chose this approach, we like, but it's certainly not the only way to academic excellence.
 
Funny, but everyone I know who went to Duke or UNC-CH is pretty into their sports.
 
Fishbelt Deac said:
Wasn't our lowest acceptance rate pre-Hatch/Wente during the Tim Duncan years?

Simplified versions is : Greater athletic success --> more applications --> lower acceptance rate --> higher ranking/better academics
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US News uses 18 factors to rank schools. Acceptance rate is not one of them.

But that isn't the point. Everyone agrees that greater athletic success leads to more applications. But greater athletic success is not the only way to achieve academic excellence, as many small schools demonstrate.
 
Rafi said:
Absolutely, and I think the school should lean harder into this narrative than they have been. But, I don't think that means that we wouldn't be as strong an academic school without P 5sports, as was suggested. Take U Chicago. They were founding members of the Big Ten, had the first Heisman winner, and then decided to deemphasize sports and went D3. They are now #12 in the US News ranking. Dropping P5 sports doesn't seem to have hurt their academics.
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How many of those schools get a new business school building every 3 years?
 
bym051d said:
How many of those schools get a new business school building every 3 years?
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Not sure I know how to answer this, but Wake's newest business school building is Ferrell hall, which was built 12 years ago. I looked up U Chicago and Carleton, both of which have much newer construction projects of academic buildings. Chicago has an incredible new engineering and science building.
 
Rafi said:
US News uses 18 factors to rank schools. Acceptance rate is not one of them.

But that isn't the point. Everyone agrees that greater athletic success leads to more applications. But greater athletic success is not the only way to achieve academic excellence, as many small schools demonstrate.
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Acceptance rate was a factor until 2019.
 
And I'm sure acceptance rate factors into perceived prestige.
 
PhDeac said:
And I'm sure acceptance rate factors into perceived prestige.
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For sure. And only 3 of the top 20 hardest schools to get in to (based on acceptance rates) play P5 sports (Stanford, Duke, and Northwestern) - the other 17 do not.
 
deacdixieboy said:
Clemson fans I know are realists. Much more so than the FSU dumbasses I know. They like the ACC and realize it’s the best path to championships. Conference realignment has worked out for basically 0 of the schools that have moved. This won’t be any different.
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Agree with this sentiment. The Clemson fans I know are head and shoulders above the FSU fans I've run across
 
Crashed a tailgate this weekend hosted by a friend of a friend who claims to be donating the big bucks to Tigers athletics. The location and amenities of his tailgate made that seem possible. Of course he brings up Clemson leaving the ACC, claiming on good authority it would be announced before Oct 25. Chatting with him later, I start with asking where Clemson is going to go and what value Clemson brings to B1G or SEC. He admits SEC doesn't really need them, but would take them to prevent the B1G from taking them. And the B1G would want them to expand into the south and challenge the SEC. I then tried to focus on the monetary value part, why would either conference dilute the per school payout to get them or would Clemson take a reduced share like other newcomers. That's when he stopped answering the question and stuck to bragging about how much prestige Clemson brings and how much better they'll be when they can start paying athletes more. I reminded him TV money can't go to players and I think he'd had enough of me.
 
At this time, I don't really want them, or f$u for that matter, in the ACC.

Good riddance and be careful what you wish for.
 
If football drives the college sports train, interesting that Big 12 wants the Zags and not Wazzu or Oregon State, both of whom have ranked football teams, but crap basketball programs.
 
Pilchard said:
If football drives the college sports train, interesting that Big 12 wants the Zags and not Wazzu or Oregon State, both of whom have ranked football teams, but crap basketball programs.
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Gonzaga has a football program? Who knew? Adding Gonzaga when UW is already joining makes little sense from a B12 standpoint.
 
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