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Danny Manning Credibility Watch

It's quite sad I vividly remember a lot of these Bz games.
 
tigerswood said:
That would be a tough argument to win. Shelton is averaging 12 points and 4 assists game having a bad shooting year. Last year, he averaged 11 points, 46% FG, 43% 3FG, 3.6 AST, 2 TO.

In Wilbekin's best year ever (this year) he's averaging 8.8 points, 39% FG, 43% 3FG, 1.5 AST, .7 TO. Shelton is also a far better defender.
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Just saying that Shelton Mitchell isn't a difference maker on any team we've had under Manning. Agree he is probably better than Wilbekin, but my point was that it isn't a slam dunk.
 
Ayo said:
Yeah, Miami was #2 at the time. CJ Harris went for like 30 in that game. NC State was ranked somewhere in the lower top 25, like #21, when we beat them in Year 3 of Bz. Too lazy to look it up. That was Devin's coming-out party game.
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Harris had 23 points... 5-5 shooting 3s.

Wake was down 10-7 and then never really looked back, aside from a Miami mini-run early in the 2nd half.

I enjoyed that game. Came right after we lost by 1 to (#104) BC at home... And right before we lost by 14 @ (#120) FSU.
 
Ayo said:
Lol, what is this nonsense? Haas decommitted from Wake and signed with Purdue on Signing Day when Bz was still the coach. And Bz is a "good" game coach now? Holy freaking hell, y'all. Absolutely ridiculous post.
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Maybe I know a little more about what happens around our program than you. Haas was tipped off that Bzz wouldn't be around to coach him 4 years.

Really, dude..Do you think Bzz leaving had nothing to do with Haas decommitting? That's just you ignoring facts.
 
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DeacsATS said:
No. No. No.

Stop trying to revise the past in order to make Manning look worse.

Also, you could argue that Shelton Mitchell is not even as good as Mitchell Wilbekin. At least Wilbekin has one skill (3 point shooting). Shelton is just OK at a lot of things.
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Not trying to revise the past. Bzz is a much better floor coach than an unproven Danny Manning.

Shelton Mitchell is a better defender, passer and slasher.

Manning doesn't need help making himself look worse.
 
DeacsATS said:
Just saying that Shelton Mitchell isn't a difference maker on any team we've had under Manning. Agree he is probably better than Wilbekin, but my point was that it isn't a slam dunk.
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Pretty much a slam dunk. Shelton would bury Wilbekin on the bench and definitely be a difference maker, not that it matters at this point.
 
Making coaching decisions based on recruits never works out. What, were we supposed to give shitty coach Bz a massive extension because of Isaac Haas? That's dumb
 
So are we assuming that Coach Fuckface would have also recruited John Collins? Or does this fucking stupid hypothetical suggest that having Haas would be better than having Collins?
 
I originally posted in response to the wolfie troll.

Regardless of how hard we all hated fuck face and how shitty he was overall as a coach, I stand by that his year 4 and (if he wasn't fired and had Haas/Shelton) year 5 teams would wax this years Wake squad 10 times outta 10.
 
Ayo said:
Creamy just throwing up some awful posts. Woof.
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That's cool, Ayo. I probably am tossin' out some dumb, hypothetical takes. I don't however come across as a giant douche bag like you though, so there's that.
 
CreamyGoodness said:
I originally posted in response to the wolfie troll.

Regardless of how hard we all hated fuck face and how shitty he was overall as a coach, I stand by that his year 4 and (if he wasn't fired and had Haas/Shelton) year 5 teams would wax this years Wake squad 10 times outta 10.
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Yep. Sad!

It's also interesting that, if the stench left by Bz wasn't so terrible, Manning would have caught/still catch a lot more flack for running off 3-4 pretty solid players/recruits.
 
Players choosing not to go to a school when the coach that was recruiting them left. What a shocker!
 
CreamyGoodness said:
I originally posted in response to the wolfie troll.

Regardless of how hard we all hated fuck face and how shitty he was overall as a coach, I stand by that his year 4 and (if he wasn't fired and had Haas/Shelton) year 5 teams would wax this years Wake squad 10 times outta 10.
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I don't know about this. Granted, the numbers will change a bit year by year based on other teams but our defense was only .4 better in adjD and 17 spots higher in 2014 compared to this year and our offense is significantly better than that team, by 3.2 adjO and 68 spots overall.

A decent comparison imo is that the 2014 team is a slightly worse Illinois, who we beat this year.
 
wsc8521s said:
Players choosing not to go to a school when the coach that was recruiting them left. What a shocker!
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Well, board insiders have specifically said that Cav and Moto wanted to play for Manning, but he wouldn't give them the time of day and made it clear they should transfer. I know for a fact that Shelton was "all-Wake" and wanted to play for Manning, but he passed on him in favor of Wilbekin. Haas, I don't know about, but it sounds like he may have actually only wanted to play for Bz.

So, no, this is not a simple case of players transferring out/decommitting because the previous coach left.
 
Ayo said:
Yeah, Miami was #2 at the time. CJ Harris went for like 30 in that game. NC State was ranked somewhere in the lower top 25, like #21, when we beat them in Year 3 of Bz. Too lazy to look it up. That was Devin's coming-out party game.
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Pretty sure NC State was ranked 18 when we beat them. I remember Julius Hodge mocking Wake on twitter because we stormed the court after beating the 18th ranked team.
 
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CreamyGoodness said:
I originally posted in response to the wolfie troll.

Regardless of how hard we all hated fuck face and how shitty he was overall as a coach, I stand by that his year 4 and (if he wasn't fired and had Haas/Shelton) year 5 teams would wax this years Wake squad 10 times outta 10.
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Wax? 10 times outta 10? OK, I'm done here.

birdman said:
Pretty sure NC State was ranked 18 when we beat them. I remember Julius Hodge mocking Wake on twitter because we stormed the court after beating the 18th ranked team.
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Good memory. I remember that now.
 
CreamyGoodness said:
Maybe I know a little more about what happens around our program than you. Haas was tipped off that Bzz wouldn't be around to coach him 4 years.

Really, dude..Do you think Bzz leaving had nothing to do with Haas decommitting? That's just you ignoring facts.
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Please explain this. Haas was committed to us until the 11th hour, signing with Purdue on November 18, 2013. Our basketball season, Bzz's last, was only 10 days old at that point, and we were undefeated. He wouldn't be fired until March 20, 2014 - over 4 months later.

Players commit to programs all the time when the coach is on the hot seat or when on-court results aren't good, like our class of '17 for example. That makes it sounds like you're alleging that Haas had some sort of very specific information about Bzz's employment status that 1) was known 4 months before he was fired and 2) stayed within the confines of the Haas family, because no one else knew anything about until the days-to-hours before the firing was announced.
 
It's impossible to know for sure because of who left after Manning took over, but Jeff [name redacted]'s fourth year team finished 117th in KenPom. Danny Manning's first team started at 104 and ended at 120.

I am guessing that had everybody stayed then our team would've been somewhere in the 80-90 range in KenPom for [name redacted]'s 5th season. To say that his 5th year team would "wax this years team 10/10 times" is probably pretty far off-base considering this year's team is currently 91st. It would likely have been a 5-5 split purely looking at the stats.

I'm not going to go through position by position and compare it out, but sweeping statements like that are pretty disingenuous.
 
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