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F is for Fascism (Ferguson MO)

Liquid Karma said:
This is the worst possible situation for the police. Without video or eyewitnesses, any justification they give will not be trusted because of the current environment concerning police violence, and it's a mess of their own making.

The problem police are going to have going forward is that they have lost the benefit of the doubt from a large portion of the population they serve. There are going to be instances where the shooting was justified, and while they may win the legal battle based on their word vs. nobody else's, they will lose the battle in the court of public opinion. Without video and multiple eyewitnesses, there simply is no defense they can mount that will seem plausible unless there is evidence of a victim actually discharging a firearm.
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I agree with this, and it is why a massive overhaul of the way that policing works in the United States is needed.
 
Liquid Karma said:
This is the worst possible situation for the police. Without video or eyewitnesses, any justification they give will not be trusted because of the current environment concerning police violence, and it's a mess of their own making.

The problem police are going to have going forward is that they have lost the benefit of the doubt from a large portion of the population they serve. There are going to be instances where the shooting was justified, and while they may win the legal battle based on their word vs. nobody else's, they will lose the battle in the court of public opinion. Without video and multiple eyewitnesses, there simply is no defense they can mount that will seem plausible unless there is evidence of a victim actually discharging a firearm.
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As it should be. We can't continue to treat police as a typical defendant with respect to reasonable doubt and on top of that take the word of police as the sole evidence against the rest of us.
 
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MysteryMen said:
Counterpoint, the widespread protests are really the reason this issue has gotten so much attention. I'm sure people said the same thing about MLK protesting in violation of the injunction in Birmingham back in the day
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Right, and this somewhat goes to the CK protesting, but I think there are effective and ineffective ways to protest.

Looting Walmarts and dropping things on cars from overpasses does not seem to be an effective way to me. It distracts from the message and makes it easy for people who disagree with the cause altogether to dismiss it and refuse to even discuss it (as we've seen some posters do on here).
 
Deacsfan27 said:
Right, and this somewhat goes to the CK protesting, but I think there are effective and ineffective ways to protest.

Looting Walmarts and dropping things on cars from overpasses does not seem to be an effective way to me. It distracts from the message and makes it easy for people who disagree with the cause altogether to dismiss it and refuse to even discuss it (as we've seen some posters do on here).
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LOL. One of the most famous protests in American history was looting and dumping stuff. They just had a classy name for it. And they were white.
 
Sequence of the Tulsa shooting is a little unclear, but it looks like the guy was tazed first and then shot. Shaky decision even to taze the guy, but an unarmed guy who had just been tazed wouldn't be a national story. If the unarmed guy had already been tazed and on the ground, the shooter needs to be put away for a long time. An old guy donor executed someone in Tulsa already. At least his excuse was lack of training and confusing his gun for a taser. Trigger vs taser in Tulsa should be an issue already. Managed to take one of the Boston Marathon bombers and the recent NYC pipe bomber alive.
 
CMPD cheif saying there are statements from "many" witnesses. Victim's gun was recovered at the scene outside of the vehicle.
 
FuckmouthedRube said:
Sequence of the Tulsa shooting is a little unclear, but it looks like the guy was tazed first and then shot. Shaky decision even to taze the guy, but an unarmed guy who had just been tazed wouldn't be a national story. If the unarmed guy had already been tazed and on the ground, the shooter needs to be put away for a long time. An old guy donor executed someone in Tulsa already. At least his excuse was lack of training and confusing his gun for a taser. Trigger vs taser in Tulsa should be an issue already. Managed to take one of the Boston Marathon bombers and the recent NYC pipe bomber alive.
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From what I've read the taze and gunshot were almost simultaneous.

Neither one was necessary based on the video and audio. The victim was very clearly racially profiled and murdered because people thought a large black male was a threat just by his very existence.
 
Assuming this is a problem that people of all races face, focusing on the racial angle only aggravates discord.

If we are looking for a solution, this needs to be framed as a police policy issue.

If we just want to rail against the problem, then present course is perfect.
 
Liquid Karma said:
From what I've read the taze and gunshot were almost simultaneous.

Neither one was necessary based on the video and audio. The victim was very clearly racially profiled and murdered because people thought a large black male was a threat just by his very existence.
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As the copter pilot said, "he looks like a bad dude".
 
knowell said:
Assuming this is a problem that people of all races face, focusing on the racial angle only aggravates discord.

If we are looking for a solution, this needs to be framed as a police policy issue.

If we just want to rail against the problem, then present course is perfect.
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I'm pretty sure both can be done in concurrence with one another.

There is a policing problem overall, as well as a racially systemic issue within that problem too, as the Baltimore DoJ reporting showed.
 
knowell said:
Assuming this is a problem that people of all races face, focusing on the racial angle only aggravates discord.

If we are looking for a solution, this needs to be framed as a police policy issue.

If we just want to rail against the problem, then present course is perfect.
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Moderate police need to speak out against radical police policy.
 
PhDeac said:
LOL. One of the most famous protests in American history was looting and dumping stuff. They just had a classy name for it. And they were white.
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Exactly. Nothing like stealing a fresh 65 inch for personal gain to protest the killing of someone in your community. The Boston Tea Party was totally the same thing.
 
CMPD chief confirms that there is both body cam footage and dash cam footage. Also says there was no book. Says cam footage contradicts social media reports.

Shooting officer was plainclothes but not undercover, had full CMPD emblazoned vest. 3 other officers were there in full uniform and each had on a body camera.
 
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Liquid Karma said:
From what I've read the taze and gunshot were almost simultaneous.

Neither one was necessary based on the video and audio. The victim was very clearly racially profiled and murdered because people thought a large black male was a threat just by his very existence.
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Video is unclear on the sequence, but does look like tazing and shooting were simultaneous. North Charleston (unarmed fleeing guy shot in the back) and Chicago (guy with a switchblade walking away shot a dozen+ times) were unambiguous. Get why people with guns get shot by cops, but it's execution when they're unarmed. Bad policing is bad policing.
 
Powerful words of hope from our next president. I hope Biff is okay.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
CMPD chief confirms that there is both body cam footage and dash cam footage. Also says there was no book. Says cam footage contradicts social media reports.

Shooting officer was plainclothes but not undercover, had full CMPD emblazoned vest. 3 other officers were there in full uniform and each had on a body camera.
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Glad we have a law where they can release the footage so the public will see the footage and this can be put to rest.
 
DG3 said:
Exactly. Nothing like stealing a fresh 65 inch for personal gain to protest the killing of someone in your community. The Boston Tea Party was totally the same thing.
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Or creating a dangerous situation for innocent motorists on the interstate by dropping large rocks on their cars from an overpass.
 
Was the guy in Charlotte really at a school bus stop waiting for his son?? What was the scene when the children arrived?
 
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