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Game of Thrones - House of the Dragon - (and beyond) Discussion (spoilers allowed)

Deacfreak07 said:
It's also important to remember that the book isn't a direct first person account. The showrunners have taken some liberties because the source material is similar to biblical writing where the accounts are written years after the event. The most direct first hand source is mushroom who is likely unreliable.
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Eh, sometimes I just think the showrunners make mistakes or do a poor job of trying to improve on something.

For example, Commander Westerling resigning from the Kingsguard when everyone made such a big deal previously about Joffrey breaking tradition by dismissing Selmy, because Kingsguard serve for life. Sometimes the showrunners make changes that don't work. The Aemond and Luke scene they changed because of that Visery quote earlier on, Targs dont control their dragons like people think. I don't think the scene worked as well as it could have, because purposefully killing Luke is more in-line with Aemond's character than what the show did. I am sure there will be other changes I disagree with as the show moves forward, but changes are because they want to tell their story a specific way.
 
I was also expecting more plot development in the finale. It was a bit weird to slow down so much after having multiple time skips earlier in the season. But I guess that’s the fun for next season.

Overall I appreciated the slower pace once it settled in. Going with 10 episodes was a good choice for a show that wants to be more character driven.

Also, I took Aemond’s hesitation to kill the kid as sort of his “breaking bad” moment. He obviously has reason to be a weird, brooding dude but he’s still young and may not have been fully committed to the evil bit yet. He takes his brother to task for being irresponsible one episode earlier. But things got out of hand and the dragon made that decision for him. He’s can either own it with his head held high or come back begging forgivenesses for a mistake. Think we know what kinda guy he’s going to be now.
 
What seems to fall flat for me is just how awful Aemond and Aegon are. I suppose they are leaning hard for Aegon into being privileged and Aemond having been shat on by his nephews / older brother but their parents seem like good people so how did they turn out so bad?
 
My take on Aemond’s reaction after (Vhagar) kills Luke (Arrax) was that he is 1. shocked that Vhagar basically went rogue and ignored his commands, 2 - reacting to killing somone (probably for the first time) and 3 - Aemond realizes that he has done something that will kickstart the war and upset his mother
 
lokisapocalypse said:
What seems to fall flat for me is just how awful Aemond and Aegon are. I suppose they are leaning hard for Aegon into being privileged and Aemond having been shat on by his nephews / older brother but their parents seem like good people so how did they turn out so bad?
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Their father basically ignored them. He was very excited about having a son, but he never truly loved Alicent like he did Aemma (at least that's what Consadine was aiming to portray). Their mother was maybe good? She strikes me as a pretty achetypical pious religious mother which carries with it plenty of baggage - not the least of which was her telling her kids throughout most of their life that their half-sister and nephews were going to try to kill them. They also had the influence of their maternal grandfather who is a raging asshole.

It was a nice moment when Luke stuck to his betrothal oath at Storm's End since the biggest insult hurled at his family for years has been that his mother did not.
 
Yeah I thought the Aemond reaction was really well done. The source material for these events is far more shallow and limited than GoT was. I mean, if Aemond was just pure murderous evil with zero hesitation or concern it would make no sense. Up to this point he's been the smart one, a bully that understands and cares about the politics of his family... If he just went psycho, happily murdered Luke, didn't consider or care about the implications - it'd be similar to when they ruined Daenerys.

It may be straying from the source to add complexity, misunderstanding, genuine concern, and unintentional outcomes to the show, but that's a positive so far imho pretty much across the board.
 
DCDeac said:
Yeah I thought the Aemond reaction was really well done. The source material for these events is far more shallow and limited than GoT was. I mean, if Aemond was just pure murderous evil with zero hesitation or concern it would make no sense. Up to this point he's been the smart one, a bully that understands and cares about the politics of his family... If he just went psycho, happily murdered Luke, didn't consider or care about the implications - it'd be similar to when they ruined Daenerys.

It may be straying from the source to add complexity, misunderstanding, genuine concern, and unintentional outcomes to the show, but that's a positive so far imho pretty much across the board.
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Also remember that the “source material” was told from the perspective of people on the ground watching the dragon fight and however Aemond and/or the Blacks spin the incident after the fact. Aemond has a curated tough guy image, so it’s not unreasonable to think he would posture and show out after the fight regardless of how he really feels.
 
DCDeac said:
Yeah I thought the Aemond reaction was really well done. The source material for these events is far more shallow and limited than GoT was. I mean, if Aemond was just pure murderous evil with zero hesitation or concern it would make no sense. Up to this point he's been the smart one, a bully that understands and cares about the politics of his family... If he just went psycho, happily murdered Luke, didn't consider or care about the implications - it'd be similar to when they ruined Daenerys.

It may be straying from the source to add complexity, misunderstanding, genuine concern, and unintentional outcomes to the show, but that's a positive so far imho pretty much across the board.
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I think you are giving him way to much credit. Where did Aemond act like the smart one or care about the politics? Getting Vhagar was an impetuous move, fighting with his cousins and bringing out the rock was a cruel move, Egging his nephews on at the dinner wasn't calculated, that was rage bursting out from being served pig, a slight that wasn't intended. His sole character trait right now is as a bully.
 
TimmyClutch said:
I think you are giving him way to much credit. Where did Aemond act like the smart one or care about the politics? Getting Vhagar was an impetuous move, fighting with his cousins and bringing out the rock was a cruel move, Egging his nephews on at the dinner wasn't calculated, that was rage bursting out from being served pig, a slight that wasn't intended. His sole character trait right now is as a bully.
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How about episode 9 where the whole point of the episode is to show that Aemond might make a better king but it is Aegon who is crowned? And the way Aemond tells his brother off? And the way he navigates the politics of his fathers death and everything after?

Or his amazing moments post taming his dragon where he tells his mother that he gained far more than losing an eye, to which Otto reminds her that he is correct?

I dont think you are giving him enough credit.
 
DeacdeTejas said:
How about episode 9 where the whole point of the episode is to show that Aemond might make a better king but it is Aegon who is crowned? And the way Aemond tells his brother off? And the way he navigates the politics of his fathers death and everything after?

Or his amazing moments post taming his dragon where he tells his mother that he gained far more than losing an eye, to which Otto reminds her that he is correct?

I dont think you are giving him enough credit.
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Episode 9 is about how unfit Aegon is, and how unworthy he is to be king. It is supposed to be a very low bar. They literally go to whore houses and child fight clubs looking for Aegon, before they finally find him hungover. Its supposed to show that anyone would be a better king than Aegon, but the Hightowers are still going to put him on the throne for their purposes even though he is a terrible choice. It shows the Greens care more about taking power than it who would be most fit to rule.

I think I remember Aemond complaining more about how he should be king over his brother, rather than showing why. I think Aemond also said he is his brother's heir even though it shows Aegon having two children. That all seems more like a whiney kid than a someone navigating politics. Its the Kingsguard who fight with swords, while the Targ brothers are rolling around the ground wrestling like children. I cant remember him navigating the politics of his father's death.
 
Oh I agree Aegon is a low bar. But there was a a few moments where the show made clear that Aemond had the opportunity to just let his brother "disappear" or not be found, and that he could have been king. He chose not to, and instead to find his brother and make sure he was installed as king.
 
When did Aemond act like the smart one? Eh, to each their own, seems like Timmy you are just hyper-negative about the show.
 
DCDeac said:
When did Aemond act like the smart one? Eh, to each their own, seems like Timmy you are just hyper-negative about the show.
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I actually really enjoy it. My problem is more that I want any changes made from the books to really improve the story. I am sure that this whole “we do not control the dragons” theme will run throughout the entire series popping up now and again, but I just don’t see the pay off yet. Also I think with the way GOT ended I am allowed to be wary of creative changes made by the show runners.

In the story they talk about Aemond prying Luke’s eyes out of his dead body, that doesn’t seem to be the actions of someone who made a whoopsie. I expect we are going to see a lot of cruel and impetuous Aemond rather than someone cunning.
 
dartsndeacs said:

‘House of the Dragon’ Cast Black Actors Just to Toss Them Aside, Like I Knew It Would​


www.yahoo.com

‘House of the Dragon’ Cast Black Actors Just to Toss Them Aside, Like I Knew It Would

The 'House of the Dragon' showrunners said they're committed to diversifying the show. Season 1, and the treatment of House Velaryon, shows they're not.
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
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From the article. This is what I mentioned in a previous post:

One of the main storylines in the first season is the denial that Rhaenyra Targaryen's children are bastards even though they have white skin and loose curly black hair while their “father” is Laenor Velaryon, a white-haired Black man with dreads. The book Fire & Blood (which the show is adapted from) also follows this plot point. But the Velaryons aren’t Black in the book, meaning it’s somewhat believable or at the very least plausible that Rhaenyra's children are Leanor's. I know this is a fantasy show, but there’s something really cringe about (1) trying to pass three obviously white children off as Black, and (2) making the one Black family on the show the center of a checks notes paternity scandal. Even if House of the Dragon were only following the book’s plot point—the question of the legitimacy of Rhaenyra’s children—the decision to cast House Velaryon and thus Laenor as Black means that race and racial connotations needed to be introduced as well. You shouldn't cast a white character as a person of color and then ignore their racial identity.
 
I’m not familiar at all with the source material, but I think Aemond purposefully killing Luke out of pure malice sounds way less nuanced than the approach they are taking. I can’t see a version of events where any of the Greens would give him permission to do that so unless he’s way more out of control than he’s been portrayed, it would just be dumb and short sighted. Making it kind of an accident allows his character more room to develop
 
Ok, I think a lot of Aemond’s personality is that he was picked on early by all the kids for not having a dragon. Him getting Vhagar was his breaking point, imo. Aemond having the largest dragon and being very well trained in battle just feeds his feelings of inadequacy or being overlooked/dismissed. Now he is the bully and the dragon scene was good I thought. I read it as many of you did, not meaning to kill the kid just intimidate and bully him. Hagar went rogue, maybe for the first time. This feeds the “dragons that haven’t been used in war“ talk. Could be straight chaos in the sky with these naive weapons of destruction.
 
Aemond wanted in his heart to kill Luke, he hated him and the Dragon felt that. When the time came, Aemond was just frightened and couldn't beleive what had happened, but imo there's no two ways about it, he wanted to hurt/kill Luke.
 
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