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MBB Game 17: WF plays the most under-performing program - Duke Wed. 7 pm ACCN

WFU71 said:
Just put him on ignore and be done with him
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I’m going nowhere of course. Ever.

The reality is Duke is a better basketball program than ours on all fronts. The fact that I’m in the heavy minority at Wake on these and other topics about mens basketball says all one needs to know about our community.
 
PhDeac said:
Some of that can be explained by how Duke recruits chronically underachieve in the NBA. Duke produces a lot of good rotation guys but relatively few legitimate stars.

Here’s the all-time list of Duke All-Stars: Grant Hill, Elton Brand, Carlos Boozer, Luol Deng, Kyrie Irving, Jayson Tatum, Brandon Ingram, Zion Williamson.

Three of Duke’s 8 All-Stars are from the last two All-Star games.



And Packer and Durham will say he shouldn’t expect to get FTs after shooting threes.
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Doesn’t change your point but I think Laettner was an All Star. And Dawkins and Jay Williams both had bad injuries - they had legit NBA skill. Hurley did too but he was unlikely to have All Star potential. Definitely true that Duke players have underachieved in NBA. Sort of the opposite, historically, for UNC players.
 
FWIW, while the sample size is smaller, WF's NBA players have routinely over-achieved (with a few exceptions).

No doubt that Laettner has an argument of having the most accomplished college career of any player since the end of the UCLA era. That said, Laettner was the 3rd overall pick in the draft, and he did make an all-star team in 1997, but he was an NBA journeyman with a non-descript pro career. He wasn't a NBA bust, but he was just another guy in the NBA. There were higher expectations for him than that. The fact that Duke has to trot out Laettner as an NBA success story tells a lot about how ordinary the vast majority of Duke players have been in the pros, particularly considering the volume of players that were given a 1st round ticket and every opportunity to succeed.

FWIW, one Duke player who exceeded expectations (and who I completely transformed my opinion of as a pro) was JJ Reddick. He played 15 NBA seasons; averaged double figuring scoring 11 seasons in a row; led the NBA in 3 point % in 2015-6. Is 15th all-time in the NBA in 3 pointers made; 36th all-time in NBA offensive efficiency.
 
Anybody selling 2 for the game tomorrow night?

Probably a longshot, but something came up (long story) and I might be driving up to Winston for this one.
 
One thing I learned from my years at Duke: they want to win MEN'S COLLEGE basketball games.

Their players that leave are great to show off for recruiting, etc. but they would have 0 pride in Chris Paul. And why would you? He didn't win COLLEGE basketball games. There is no jersey in Cameron for Kyrie Irving or Jayson Tatum and there never will be.

Here you fault Coach K for doing all he can to win college basketball games while he is Duke's head coach. That is what he should be doing. Just as Forbes is trying to do as well. We are not holier than others. Our best player is a JUCO player. Have you listened to his interviews? He didn't come to Wake Forest to be a student athlete nor should he. We are every bit as much of a sinner in this process as everyone else has been. It just took us far too long to get there.
 
donaldross said:
One thing I learned from my years at Duke: they want to win MEN'S COLLEGE basketball games.

Their players that leave are great to show off for recruiting, etc. but they would have 0 pride in Chris Paul. And why would you? He didn't win COLLEGE basketball games. There is no jersey in Cameron for Kyrie Irving or Jayson Tatum and there never will be.

Here you fault Coach K for doing all he can to win college basketball games while he is Duke's head coach. That is what he should be doing. Just as Forbes is trying to do as well. We are not holier than others. Our best player is a JUCO player. Have you listened to his interviews? He didn't come to Wake Forest to be a student athlete nor should he. We are every bit as much of a sinner in this process as everyone else has been. It just took us far too long to get there.
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:rolleyes:
 
donaldross said:
We are not holier than others. Our best player is a JUCO player. Have you listened to his interviews? He didn't come to Wake Forest to be a student athlete nor should he. We are every bit as much of a sinner in this process as everyone else has been. It just took us far too long to get there.
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I assume you are talking about Alondes Williams? He transferred to Wake after two years at Oklahoma. Can you explain your comment about his interviews?
 
Pilchard said:
FWIW, one Duke player who exceeded expectations (and who I completely transformed my opinion of as a pro) was JJ Reddick. He played 15 NBA seasons; averaged double figuring scoring 11 seasons in a row; led the NBA in 3 point % in 2015-6. Is 15th all-time in the NBA in 3 pointers made; 36th all-time in NBA offensive efficiency.
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I do agree on this, as hard as it to admit, I had a lot of respect for him as a pro. But, that also shows how sorry dook has been in the NBA, NPOY, 2 time ACCPOY, and he had to find his role in the NBA. As opposed to most of the dook NBA losers, that are anonymous role players, JJ was a weapon from 3. He could have packed in and not done the work and just move to dook basketball players alternate career as ESPN analysts.
 
JJ Redick was a McD AA game MVP, 2 time ACC POY, NPOY, considered the greatest college shooter of all time. He was a journeyman shooter who started just over half his games and averaged 12.8 ppg. I wouldn’t say he overachieved.
 
PhDeac said:
JJ Redick was a McD AA game MVP, 2 time ACC POY, NPOY, considered the greatest college shooter of all time. He was a journeyman shooter who started just over half his games and averaged 12.8 ppg. I wouldn’t say he overachieved.
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Not going to spend a ton of time defending JJ, but take a look at the 2006 NBA draft. JJ was picked 11th. Just after Mouhamed Sene and just before Hilton Armstrong. Of the 30 first round picks that year, the only players with better NBA careers were LeMarcus Aldridge, Kyle Lowry and Rajob Rondo. With an argument either way on Brandon Roy who started great, but only played 5 years, and Rudy Gay. JJ outperformed where he was drafted. FWIW, another classic Duke flameout from that draft was Shelden Williams. #5 pick in that draft, and sucked.
 
Rafi said:
I assume you are talking about Alondes Williams? He transferred to Wake after two years at Oklahoma. Can you explain your comment about his interviews?
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He transferred to Wake after graduating from Oklahoma.

He’s one of the smartest players we’ve had on the court in a long time. His interviews suggest he’s pretty smart off the court as well.
 
Rafi said:
I assume you are talking about Alondes Williams? He transferred to Wake after two years at Oklahoma. Can you explain your comment about his interviews?
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Alondes Williams played two years of JUCO basketball. It’s ok, you can say it out loud Wake alums. Isn’t it great he did? Just because he then went to Oklahoma or toured Paris or Rome doesn’t make him any less of a former JUCO player.

Let’s get 6 of them next year. If 1 turns out like him, it was well worth it.

But No, Wake alums, you can’t pretend we don’t take JUCO players. He’s a JUCO player. Own it. It’ll be ok.
 
While DR's overall bit is stale, he does know how to throw just enough chum in the water.
 
He also doesn't speak like a duke loving lawyer... so...

Ain't gonna Pilch. Aldondes has earned our appreciation. Love his game.
 
So what if we take JUCO’s? Who has a problem with that? I don’t see people criticizing that (now that Wellman - Mr Culture - is gone.)
 
i'm trying not to read too into donaldross's post, but it's kind of hard not to
 
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