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Ongoing Dem Debacle Thread: Commander will kill us all

Wakeforest22890 said:
It can be simultaneously true that liberals overstate racism and that the President is a racist.

In the last two weeks Donald has told four Congresswomen of color to go back to their country (three were born here and one's family is from Puerto Rico - so America from the get go) and has for the second time - after John Lewis a couple year's ago - referenced a Congressman's home district as a "disgusting, rat and rodent infested mess." Notably he has never told any non-people of color to go back to their own country nor has he used such critical language towards any white member's home districts.

This is racist language. He continues to use such language and it's because he's a racist. History will certainly condemn the Sailors of the world who fiddled about political correctness while an overt racist used the presidency to lobby racist attacks at members of Congress.
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Might be an intentional effort to reconnect with a certain segment of his base who have not experienced some of the economic benefit Trump promised. I imagine he is concerned about getting their vote again in 2020.
 
Buttermaker said:
Might be an intentional effort to reconnect with a certain segment of his base who have not experienced some of the economic benefit Trump promised. I imagine he is concerned about getting their vote again in 2020.
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The impostor syndrom that I imagine comes with being a carpet bagging fraud.

Alas, he has nothing to worry about. If you didn't realize what he was in 2016, it's going to be tough to change your opinion in 2020. I think there are a lot of people hiding behind the Hillary excuse when in reality they simply want a guy like Trump.
 
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Demonwolverine said:
The impostor syndrom that I imagine comes with being a carpet bagging fraud.

Alas, he has nothing to worry about. If you didn't realize what he was in 2016, it's going to be tough to change your opinion in 2020. I think there are a lot of people hiding behind the Hillary excuse when in reality they simply want a guy like Trump.
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Yeah, maybe. But he really hasn't delivered to the blue collar, midwestern worker as promised. But he may be perceived as better than the alternative...
 
Ongoing Dem Debacle Thread: Boomers continue self destruction

The only way conservatives can sell policies that only benefit the rich is with racial division. They did it by calling Native Americans savages. They did it with slavery. They did it in the Reconstruction. They did it with the Chinese Exclusion Act. They did with Jim Crow. Poor whites stay on board while the wealthy leave the high and dry. The dumbasses fought and died for the right to own slaves they couldn’t afford and claim it was in the name of “states rights.”
 
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Newenglanddeac said:
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Newenglanddeac said:
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That is just cyclical reactionary politics. A huge portion of the electorate, overwhelmingly the young, poor, and disenfranchised, are simply never going to support these institutional Dem coalitions without major challenges to social and economic institutions. The people you're quoting are simply going to spend the rest of their comfortable lives pontificating about which way suburban moderates will vote in the next election. Every Republican President will be the anti-christ, every Democrat unimpeachable. Just sports.
 
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You must be incredibly fun at parties
 
Especially suburban parties.
 
AsesinoDeTortugas said:
You must be incredibly fun at parties
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PhDeac said:
Especially suburban parties.
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Well If you all talk about politics at parties then I'm probably a lot more fun than you. Beyond that, I'm simply stating that the Democratic Party should be challenging the establishment in order to expand it's electorate, and that means looking beyond the next election. It's very clear that the party is going nowhere by simply living paycheck to paycheck browbeating it's voting base every 8 years. Honestly, where is the acknowledgement from the Dem establishment that every critical achievement we're vying for now was achieved in 2008 by Obama and yet we only held power for 3 years, and nearly every progressive achievement of that era has been rolled back. So every comment made by Democrats saying "We have to win elections first AND THEN we can argue about x" rings hollow.
 
I don’t disagree with that. It’s something I mention pretty regularly.

White Dems ran to the mythical middle and took the base for granted.
 
AsesinoDeTortugas said:
You must be incredibly fun at parties
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PhDeac said:
Especially suburban parties.
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PhDeac said:
I don�t disagree with that. It�s something I mention pretty regularly.

White Dems ran to the mythical middle and took the base for granted.
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I think where I disagree with you is about exactly who the "base" is. A shitload of voters were disenfranchised and suppressed in 2016. (and 2018), but the voters who chose to stay home or vote third party are not part of the Dem base, as much as Dems want to claim them. Politically active liberals have to recognize that America has 55-60% voter participation at best. As important/critical/engaging as we consider these current political battles, there are just as many people disconnected from them. Where I take major issue with Democrats is how spitefully they scorn non-voters without ever considering why they don't vote. It's not as if these non-voters are silent or invisible, we know who they are and we know why they don't vote. Rather than fighting for these people's votes, we just ignore them and compromise our values to fight over the dozen "undecided" white assholes in Silver Springs Maryland or Staten Island who all have very strong opinions about the deficit.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
I think where I disagree with you is about exactly who the "base" is. A shitload of voters were disenfranchised and suppressed in 2016. (and 2018), but the voters who chose to stay home or vote third party are not part of the Dem base, as much as Dems want to claim them. Politically active liberals have to recognize that America has 55-60% voter participation at best. As important/critical/engaging as we consider these current political battles, there are just as many people disconnected from them. Where I take major issue with Democrats is how spitefully they scorn non-voters without ever considering why they don't vote. It's not as if these non-voters are silent or invisible, we know who they are and we know why they don't vote. Rather than fighting for these people's votes, we just ignore them and compromise our values to fight over the dozen "undecided" white assholes in Silver Springs Maryland or Staten Island who all have very strong opinions about the deficit.
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TITCR

Anybody who says otherwise better be ready for another 4 years of ethnic cleansing, mass shootings, and (shudder) political incivility.
 
Why is it that Democrats are so concerned about "electability" and pandering to some imaginary conservative swing voter. It's either too clever by half or just disengenious.
 
I think that pedantry re: electability and pandering to non-existing voting blocs allow folks like itc to sit back, shit on anything that wouldn't fit in a 90s-era moderate Republican manifesto, and consider their message board trolling civic engagement.
 
I posted this on the nominees thread, but this thread proves LBJ's words:

"Do you know the difference between cannibals and Democrats? - Cannibals don't eat their own."
 
Sadly, it's true. Too many Dems stayed home rather than voting for Hillary. Dems are already attacking each other and creating tough moats to cross to get them back to beat Trump. To say any Dem running this time is like voting for Trump shows an idiocy that is dumbfounding.
 
RJKarl said:
Sadly, it's true. Too many Dems stayed home rather than voting for Hillary. Dems are already attacking each other and creating tough moats to cross to get them back to beat Trump. To say any Dem running this time is like voting for Trump shows an idiocy that is dumbfounding.
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RJ, what data do you have that shows that too many Dems stayed home because they didn't want to vote for Hillary in battleground states?

Y'all love ripping on DSA, for instance, but the majority of DSA activity occurs in majority Democrat districts. Chapters in red states are really small. Hell, chapters in non-coastal blue areas (e.g., DSA in Denver) are really small (<25 people). I would argue that ripping on DSA is a far more "cannibalistic" activity than refusing to endorse a candidate (while likely doing a ton of canvasing activities for them in the general, regardless, which is far more than folks like ITC and ChrisL will do from their suburban basements).
 
https://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-trump-2016-election-654320

"According to the analysis of the 2016 Cooperative Congressional Election Survey, fewer than 80 percent of those who voted for Sanders, an independent, in the Democratic primary did the same for Clinton when she faced off against Trump a few months later. What's more, 12 percent of those who backed Sanders actually cast a vote for Trump."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/realsp...ders-voters-like-me-stayed-home/#1ee12478539f

There are lots of such articles.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Results_of_the_2016_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries

According to this, Bernie got 598,000+ votes in Michigan. Even if the article that show a 12% slippage are off by 50%, it would have cost Hillary about 36,000 votes. That's more than enough to carry MI. In PA, Bernie got over 780,000 votes, just the 12% would have been about 80,000 votes. That's more than enough to swing the state. In WI, Bernie got 570,000 votes. Hillary lost by less than 24,000.

Also remember on the switched votes, if you lose by 100, you don't have to get 101 new votes. You only need to switch 51 of the switched votes to win.

All of the above is even before adding in those who stayed home.

There is no question the disloyalty of the Bernie voters were a major factor in Hillary losing and if they act the same way this time, Trump could win again.

I am not saying Hillary's laziness and arrogance in not campaigning in those and other states wasn't also a major factor, but Bernie and his followers do have a lot of blame.

What you don't get about DSA is that the GOP is and will continue to use the term "socialist" to drive suburbanites and others away from voting for any Dem. You are proudly proving ammo for Trump. Like it or not, the vast majority of Americans don't want to be called socialists.

As to cannibalization, look at how Dems attacked the most popular Dem in the past quarter century at the most recent debate. A bunch of them piled on Obama over and over.
 
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