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SCOTUS to rule on marriage equality

Roy Moore was on Fox News Sunday. He was all over the map on his justifications for instructing probate judges not to comply with federal rulings on marriage equality. Chris Wallace seemed completely flummoxed and really uncomfortable. Was in stark contrast to Wallace's demeanor when interviewing Ted Olson before arguing against Prop 8. Seemed like a producer on someone higher up at Fox wanted Moore as a guest and Wallace hadn't bought into it at all. Don't see a whole lot of upside for conservatives to rally around Roy Moore.
 
Moore might deserve his own thread. Here are my thoughts on him and the issue there.

1. His legal argument can be summarized as follows: one gay couple in Alabama sued, the case was heard by a federal district court judge, and she found the ban there to be unconstitutional. So, in his world, that ruling should only apply to the couple who sued, since her ruling is limited to the case brought before her.

2. The main problem with Moore's argument is the judge stayed her own ruling to allow the state an appeal. Neither the 11th COA or SCOTUS would intervene with her ruling, which mandated the state to start letting these marriages occur on the 9th. The higher courts have spoken.

3. Moore, as you would expect, loved to use the term "states' rights." I find it absurd that the political party from which he hails shoves their love of the federal constitution down our ears every soundbite they get, yet gets away with using states' rights as a legit excuse to ignore the parts of the constitution they could do without.

4. I watch FNS every week, and actually like Chris Wallace a lot. I can't decide whether giving Moore airtime was the right call, but I agree that Wallace did seem annoyed by his presence.

5. Some of you might remember the Ten Commandments case in Alabama, and remember Moore was involved then too. Then, you might wonder how this character is Chief Justice of that state, and who he seemingly refuses to act like it. Well, like NC, judges there are elected. And before we turn our noses up at the electorate, NC has not exactly been progressive on this issue either. It's nothing but sad that so many people hate other humans for their sexual orientation, because of a line or two in an old book of rules for ignorant nomadic desert people. But I digress.
 
Man Alabama has to be the most backward state in the country and that says a lot when I live in SC.
 
Roy Moore's back in the news. Alabama now refusing to abide by federal lower court ruling. Get that it's Alabama, but is his end game to run for Governor based on not allowing gays to marry for a few months? What's his move after the Supreme Court weighs in definitively?
 
This isn't the way rational basis review works. The question isn't whether the legislature could have come up with a law that better suits the law's purpose. The question is whether the law in question is supported by a rational basis. Traditional marriage laws plainly satisfy that standard for the reasons I've set forth. The only way a court could legitimately strike down traditional marriage statutes within the current legal framework would be to create some sort of favored status for homosexuals. In that regard, activist judges have been all too willing to comply.

Moreover, even if one were to accept your incorrect characterization of rational basis review, your argument still fails. A legislature could rationally conclude that giving favored status to traditional marriage (over and above same-sex marriage) is more likely to encourage some people to enter into it and, thereby, have kids that they otherwise wouldn't have. This could occur in at least two ways. First, a legislature could rationally conclude that some portion of homosexuals prefer members of their own sex by choice (conscious or otherwise) and that, by offering them an option to be married to a member of their own sex, they are encouraging behavior that is unlikely to result in procreation. Second, a legislature could rationally conclude that expanding marriage beyond its traditional definition to include same-sex unions diminishes the societal uniqueness and importance of marriage, particularly insofar as one of the traditional purposes of marriage is for procreation, thereby deterring heterosexuals from entering into it. This would decrease both the likelihood of procreation and the likelihood that a stable environment awaits the children who are born.

I personally believe that same-sex unions are good policy. But they are not required by the constitution on anything that resembles a faithful interpretation of it.

No they couldn't.

As to your second justification: the legislature would have to conclude that defining marriage in a limiting way was likely serve the legitimate purpose of encouraging procreation. I think the scenario you describe strains credulity and while rational basis is a very low standard it is still a standard. Logical impossibility is not and should not be required before a law fails to meet that standard, and absent some evidence that marriage laws might actually or possibly have the effect you describe I have a hard time believing that a legislature could rationally conclude as much.
 
Roy Moore's back in the news. Alabama now refusing to abide by federal lower court ruling. Get that it's Alabama, but is his end game to run for Governor based on not allowing gays to marry for a few months? What's his move after the Supreme Court weighs in definitively?

secede
 

2339_bye.jpg
 
If the south left the U.S. and attempted some of the policies they want to pass in the southern states where would that nation rank on the freedom house scale for freedom? Not very well I would imagine. Probably pretty high on economics though.

How would that nation generate revenue? Maybe take the Midwest with them too and live off all agriculture?
 
If the south left the U.S. and attempted some of the policies they want to pass in the southern states where would that nation rank on the freedom house scale for freedom? Not very well I would imagine. Probably pretty high on economics though.

How would that nation generate revenue? Maybe take the Midwest with them too and live off all agriculture?
Would be Albania West.
 
Slightly OT, but what exactly do Cruz, Huckabee, Carson, Santorum, Perry, and Jindal think they can possibly do after the SC definitively rules on marriage equality? It's painfully obvious it's a done deal, so why run on this issue when there's nothing they can do after the fact? Transgender issues are still 10-15 years away from being decided, but there's no question social conservatives will screw that up too.
 
Slightly OT, but what exactly do Cruz, Huckabee, Carson, Santorum, Perry, and Jindal think they can possibly do after the SC definitively rules on marriage equality? It's painfully obvious it's a done deal, so why run on this issue when there's nothing they can do after the fact? Transgender issues are still 10-15 years away from being decided, but there's no question social conservatives will screw that up too.

Jindal appears to be holding firm: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/04/bobby-jindal-gay-marriage-opposition-nyt-op-ed-117277.html
 
Well, it would shrink the federal government insofar as it would leave the issue to the states. If, however, the SCOTUS requires the gay marriage, it would also certainly be unconstitutional.

Requiring gay marriage upon all citizens probably would be unconstitutional. We are in agreement. I don't think the SCOTUS should do that.
 

Jindal's gotta be the dumbest Rhodes Scholar ever. If the NFL pulled a Super Bowl from AZ over the MLK holiday and the NCAA was pissed about Mike Pence, Jindal still thinks the Super Dome would still host SBs, F4s, and the college football championship? Duck Dynasty may be on-board, but they don't have the same political clout, lobbyists, and cash as Wal-Mart, Intel, and Eli Lilly.
 
Isn't he just decrying capitalism? Businesses think it's bad policy and so they're speaking out against it. This is the market at work that you worship Bobby boy, suck it up.
 
I think he's decrying that business isn't 100% aligned with social conservatives.
 
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