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The New Socialists

DeacinAfrica said:
The above quote is very good IMO. I think I represent a large percentage of Republicans, at least in the Christian World View camp. We cannot stand most of what President Trump says. We like some things he does. But there is no other option. I wish there were 4-5 strong political parties, because we can't vote for any Democrat. Infanticide is repulsive (I am not trying to start a debate here, just stating reality from our World View); any form of socialism does not help people, poor or rich (again, you may disagree, which is fine, but this is the position of most of us); we love people, but don't try to force us to support things we think are morally wrong. We will never support these positions which the Democratic Party seems to have taken. This leave us with President Trump. Unless something changes, we will hold our nose and try not to vomit as we vote for Trump.
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I mean this would be true if it were "hold your nose and vote for" Donald, but 90 percent of self-identified Republicans have a "favorable" view of him. So this isn't true.
 
DG3 said:
I think this gets fixed when we all, at a grassroots level, extend an olive branch, stop assuming bad faith from everyone on the "other side," and recognize that our opinions, no matter how deeply held, can be ill-conceived.
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#bebest
 
PhDeac said:
There’s really no excuse for the current GOP after the Atwater explanation he was a chief strategist for Reagan and he specifically explained that modern conservative thought came about as a way to punish black people without explicitly saying “nigger, nigger, nigger.”
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Right and the result was that if you aren't doing the latter, conservatives say it isn't racist and that the left is overusing the term "racist"
 
Sorry #neverTrumpers the only way to kick him out is to let conservatives say the N word again.
 

  • Abortion isn't infanticide.


    infanticide

    [inˈfan(t)əˌsīd]




    NOUN


    • the crime of killing a child within a year of birth.
      "cases of infanticide often involve extreme emotional disturbance"
      synonyms:
      murder · taking of life · assassination · homicide · manslaughter · liquidation · [more]




      • the practice in some societies of killing unwanted children soon after birth.
        "female infanticide was practiced to reduce the population in times of famine"


    • a person who kills an infant, especially their own child.



    ​



 
DeacinAfrica said:
The above quote is very good IMO. I think I represent a large percentage of Republicans, at least in the Christian World View camp. We cannot stand most of what President Trump says. We like some things he does. But there is no other option. I wish there were 4-5 strong political parties, because we can't vote for any Democrat. Infanticide is repulsive (I am not trying to start a debate here, just stating reality from our World View); any form of socialism does not help people, poor or rich (again, you may disagree, which is fine, but this is the position of most of us); we love people, but don't try to force us to support things we think are morally wrong. We will never support these positions which the Democratic Party seems to have taken. This leave us with President Trump. Unless something changes, we will hold our nose and try not to vomit as we vote for Trump.
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Thanks for the response and welcome.

Disregarding the socialism boogeyman, how do you reconcile being pro life with Donald Trump’s actions that are very anti-life?

Examples:
-being beholden to the NRA and not doing anything about gun reform when kids in schools, Garlic festivals, Walmart’s, etc, are being murdered?
-separating kids from their parents which causes big psychological damage? And keeping them longer from their parents than the law says?
-kids dying in his CBP facilities?
-drone strikes that kill innocent kids and supplying stupid bombs to the Saudis that killed a bus load of 30 kids?

Moreover, is his divisiveness and blatant bigotry worth it to folks like you, so that you can keep “pro life” judges?

Also, I’d love to know if you are a Christian. I suspect you are, but I could be wrong.

I am genuinely curious as to the above.
 
Or how about Donald being pro-choice for decades before he decided he wanted to court evangelicals? Conservatives, evangelicals and dum dums took what he was selling hook line and sinker.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
I mean this would be true if it were "hold your nose and vote for" Donald, but 90 percent of self-identified Republicans have a "favorable" view of him. So this isn't true.
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The whole "Christian" World View (which is not all Christians, of course, just Evangelical/Fundamentalist and conservative Catholic) would be more credible on pro-life issues if they and their party seemed to give a damn about the baby and mother once the child was born, rather than cutting social services and child welfare programs all the time, and if they were actively using government to make it easier to adopt. Looking at the GOP record, it's hard not to conclude that the real Religious Right attitude towards abortion and infants is "Well, honey, we're going to use the government to force you to have that baby, but once it's born you and the kid are on your own. Good Luck!" That's not very pro-life when you look at it.

As to opposition to socialism, that would also be more credible if it wasn't for the fact that tens of millions of older conservative Christians are living on Social Security and Medicare, two social welfare programs, and without them many of these people couldn't survive. And the GOP, btw, bitterly opposed both programs at the time they were created, and claimed they were socialist, or worse. Yet now the GOP olds love them. I have no doubt (and, in fact, know from experience) that many conservatives are indeed sincere in their opposition to the pro-choice position on abortion, and to what they think is "socialism", yet those beliefs are often contradictory, don't really stand up to scrutiny, and don't match their actions in accepting social welfare programs or helping infants (and their mothers) once they're born.

ETA: On abortion, I should also have added the Religious Right's opposition to teaching practical sex ed and birth control information is hypocritical too. If they really wanted to reduce unwanted pregnancies (and thus abortions), they should be in support of freely teaching birth control information. Instead, in most cases they vigorously oppose it and push "abstinence-only" in spite of the evidence that it doesn't work. It's almost as if their goal is to have lots of women having lots of babies, wanted or not.
 
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Hopefully he’ll come back and engage in a productive dialogue in response.
 
DeacinAfrica said:
The above quote is very good IMO. I think I represent a large percentage of Republicans, at least in the Christian World View camp. We cannot stand most of what President Trump says. We like some things he does. But there is no other option. I wish there were 4-5 strong political parties, because we can't vote for any Democrat. Infanticide is repulsive (I am not trying to start a debate here, just stating reality from our World View); any form of socialism does not help people, poor or rich (again, you may disagree, which is fine, but this is the position of most of us); we love people, but don't try to force us to support things we think are morally wrong. We will never support these positions which the Democratic Party seems to have taken. This leave us with President Trump. Unless something changes, we will hold our nose and try not to vomit as we vote for Trump.
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Trump has done many immoral things throughout his life. He's broken multiple Commandments many times each. He has stolen hundreds of millions of dollars, coveted and acted on adultery, he has born false witness and done all of those over and over throughout his entire adult life.

In Matthew, Jesus said, "For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me." Not only doesn't Trump welcome the stranger, his evil acts have caused the deaths of innocent children who were immigrants.

There's much, much more. It seems you don't hold Trump's immorality to the same standards you hold Dems. I'm not saying you should vote for a Dem, but if you are using morals and The Bible as methods to disqualify a candidate, no one has defied The Word more than Donald Trump. It's not even close.

It's not about holding your nose. If your vote is about morality and The Word, you can't vote for Trump without being a hypocrite,
 
If you’re pro life, seems to me you should be consistently pro life across the board: anti abortion, anti death penalty, anti war (the usa’s current version of war, not WWII), anti immigrant kids dying in US custody, etc. Also, republicans didn’t adopt abortion as a moral platform of their politics until the southern strategy. Prior to that, they were fine with women making decisions for their own bodies.

Anyway, curious to his thoughts.
 
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DDA said:
If you’re pro life, seems to me you should be consistently pro life across the board: anti abortion, anti death penalty, anti war (the usa’s current version of war, not WWII), anti immigrant kids dying in US custody, etc. Also, republicans didn’t adopt abortion as a moral platform of their politics until the southern strategy. Prior to that, they were fine with women making decisions for their own bodies.

Anyway, curious to his thoughts.
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Yeah I can’t understand how in a Christian worldview a morning after pill outweighs all of that. Doesn’t Christian scripture have something to say about that stuff too?
 
Blanket statements like “any form of socialism is bad for anyone” is not reflective of even a basic level of thinking about what that means. I really hope you come back to expand on that because it’s just a flaming hot take.
 
06deacon said:
Blanket statements like “any form of socialism is bad for anyone” is not reflective of even a basic level of thinking about what that means. I really hope you come back to expand on that because it’s just a flaming hot take.
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Bro have you seen Venezuela lately?
 
06deacon said:
Blanket statements like “any form of socialism is bad for anyone” is not reflective of even a basic level of thinking about what that means. I really hope you come back to expand on that because it’s just a flaming hot take.
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To be fair, Pubs do hate public education.
 
First thing, is isn't it curious that DeacInAfrica and Pineapple showed at the same time and have similar styles?

Here's another specific question for DeacInAFrica- You oppose Dems because of "infanticide". Then, how can you support Trump when his new policy is effectively and intentionally going to kill innocent, sick children who have already been born and are being kicked out of the United States?

Treatment for their illnesses doesn't exist in their home countries. Trump PROUDLY talks about his evil treatment of children as a "DETERRENT".

How can you justify supporting/voting for someone whose POLICY is to MURDER children for his own political gain?
 
If he had any sense, he'd think they are lazy, whining, internet circle jerking, waaahmbulance riders (driving would take assuming some responsibility), who blame everyone for causing their problems.

GEEZ, isn't that obvious???????
 
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