Wake vs. Clemson Game Thread (Deacs Pummeled Again)

[mebanedeac]

I think that a change should happen sooner rather than later. That was not my sentiment when the season began; but, I fear we are in an irreversible downward cycle apart from radical changes in leadership.

That said, there is only so much that a coach can do. He can work his team over and over on defensive and offensive strategies. He can teach techniques. He can yell and scream or threaten or demean or communicate shame or try to teach self-esteem and appeal to pride. But, once the game begins he is at the mercy of the players themselves. That is especially the case when you do not have a bench that allows you to yank players who are failing or who aren't playing hard. That is not an option for Bz.

He is paid to coach. He must assume the responsibility for performance and outcomes. Still, he is limited by his players.

But perhaps his players are limited by him. Perhaps he doesn't know how to scheme or how to teach or how to motivate. Perhaps he has a world of talent at his disposal and just doesn't know how to bring it out on the court. Perhaps.

 

[DownEastDeac]

Man, I can't help but feel bad for the guy. No, no one made him take this job. And yes, he is in way over his head but the guy does seem to genuinely take these loses to heart. Nothing would make me happier than for him to be successful at Wake Forest though I felt from day one he would not.

Same here. No need/no excuse for the level of cruelty expressed by some on this board towards another human being for whom this is his dream job. There's a reason he sent his daughter 2/3 across the country to attend WFU, and it had nothing to do with his thinking that would give him a shot at coaching here some day.

 

[Fusiondad10]

1) Will the bleeding hearts please grow up and realize that nobody hates Bz the man, or his family, and nobody wished he'd fail. The more perceptive of us simply recognized he likely would fail, and said so.

2) The fault is that he's not good at his job, and it is just a job. Therefore, a change must be made to produce the desire result of this job. It's strictly business.

3) Anyone who claims that CJ Harris and Travis McKie are giving up or aren't working hard enough is simply a blind idiot. Those two kids have done EVERYTHING right because they have consistently broken their backs to do exactly what Bz coached 'em to do. They have sacrificed their good names, their egos, and their self esteem to be culture warriors for Wellman, Bz, and their teammates. The problem is simple....no matter what they do, this will not work under Bz, and they are only human, kids, individuals, players. They have no control over the outcomes except for themselves, and if they crack under the strain of carrying the team and coaches on their backs no one should be surprised. They are blameless heroes in my mind who deserve much better then what they've been given. We'll be very lucky if they finish their careers as Deacons. I'm proud of them.

 

[vtwhat etc]

1) Will the bleeding hearts please grow up and realize that nobody hates Bz the man, or his family, and nobody wished he'd fail. The more perceptive of us simply recognized he likely would fail, and said so.

2) The fault is that he's not good at his job, and it is just a job. Therefore, a change must be made to produce the desire result of this job. It's strictly business.

3) Anyone who claims that CJ Harris and Travis McKie are giving up or aren't working hard enough is simply a blind idiot. Those two kids have done EVERYTHING right because they have consistently broken their backs to do exactly what Bz coached 'em to do. They have sacrificed their good names, their egos, and their self esteem to be culture warriors for Wellman, Bz, and their teammates. The problem is simple....no matter what they do, this will not work under Bz, and they are only human, kids, individuals, players. They have no control over the outcomes except for themselves, and if they crack under the strain of carrying the team and coaches on their backs no one should be surprised. They are blameless heroes in my mind who deserve much better then what they've been given. We'll be very lucky if they finish their careers as Deacons. I'm proud of them.

I want to be very clear on (1.): I hate Bz the man as much as, if not more than, Bz the coach.

Some of it is because of how he handles his business (see 2.); but you don't leave Air Force the way he did, trash your players at every turn, and behave like he has without losing respect from me (and I hope, others) on the personal level.

If he was just a bad coach; I wouldn't be nearly as adamant that he have nothing to do with Wake Forest moving forward.

I wish nothing bad upon his family & I hope they all live comfortably on the millions of dollars that he's already inexplicably made being terrible at his profession.

 

[slothrop]

[Redacted] is making a guy as passionate as Travis McKie seem like he's miserable playing basketball. That's as big an indictment on him as a coach as anything else.

 

[Deac83]

He's now laying all the blame on the players. Saying the team has limitations, no low post scoring, very little shooting, not mentally strong enough to do the fundamentals of the game.

That's what people say here as well.

 

[TBR]

That's what people say here as well.

And they are wrong. Compare us to BC or Clemson.

 

[Deadbolt]

That's what people say here as well.

Maybe he's feeling heat and trying to displace as much of the blame as possible to buy more time.

Wishful thinking, probably.

 

[Deac83]

Amazing that people bash Travis, the only person man enough to take any accountability for this team. He's in a slump, but he's a legit talent.

So one of our top two players (on a team that is completely dependent on it's top two players for the majority of it's offense) has been in a slump since FSU and we are getting crushed during this time period.

Basketball is such a mystery.

 

[WFdeacon04]

Had an exam today, so just catching up on this after seeing the score... just so pathetic - Wellman needs to make a decision and soon. I can't imagine actually bringing him back next year.

Remember when these threads were 100 pages long - the entire fan base is absolutely apathetic.

 

[TBR]

So one of our top two players (on a team that is completely dependent on it's top two players for the majority of it's offense) has been in a slump since FSU and we are getting crushed during this time period.

Basketball is such a mystery.

Clemson is a 0.500 team. We made 18 more free throws than them yet loss by 20 points. The problem isn't a player averaging 16 points scoring 10.

I would also argue that we aren't putting him in a position to succeed. He's great at cutting to the basket, but how many times do we actually have him do that?

 

[Deac83]

And they are wrong. Compare us to BC or Clemson.

We have low post scoring?

 

[Turd Ferguson]

So one of our top two players (on a team that is completely dependent on it's top two players for the majority of it's offense) has been in a slump since FSU and we are getting crushed during this time period.

Basketball is such a mystery.

Apparently to Ron. I know he must be shocked at this outcome when he hired a coach with such a proven college coaching track record.

 

[Turd Ferguson]

Had an exam today, so just catching up on this after seeing the score... just so pathetic - Wellman needs to make a decision and soon. I can't imagine actually bringing him back next year.

Remember when these threads were 100 pages long - the entire athletic department is absolutely apathetic.

FIFY

 

[OldGoldBeard]

That's what people say here as well.

You're the imbecile who said we could go 8-8 or 9-7 in conference after the BC game. You must not have thought our talent was so bad at that point.

 

[TBR]

We have low post scoring?

They are getting better as the season progresses instead of worse. Less than a month ago we lost at Clemson by 11. Today we lost by 20 at home to the same team with the same players by 20.

 

[Deac83]

Since I doubt more than one or two of use listened to the postgame.

The point he was making about mental toughness was that defense and rebounding do not require specific skills that scoring and dribbling do.

Defense and rebounding is about desire and heart (my words not his).

 

[WakeForestRanger]

I want to be very clear on (1.): I hate Bz the man as much as, if not more than, Bz the coach.

Some of it is because of how he handles his business (see 2.); but you don't leave Air Force the way he did, trash your players at every turn, and behave like he has without losing respect from me (and I hope, others) on the personal level.

If he was just a bad coach; I wouldn't be nearly as adamant that he have nothing to do with Wake Forest moving forward.

I wish nothing bad upon his family & I hope they all live comfortably on the millions of dollars that he's already inexplicably made being terrible at his profession.

This is crazy.

 

[Complacent Deac]

[Redacted] has terrible communication skills.

Not sure how in hell he made it this far.

 

[Complacent Deac]

[Redacted] is making a guy as passionate as Travis McKie seem like he's miserable playing basketball. That's as big an indictment on him as a coach as anything else.

This is THE reason Wellman needs to step in and fix this. Does Wellman even have a clue about this?