WF Marching Band

[HONDO2]

BC has like 2,000 more students than Notre Dame. The Irish band has +360 members....Eagles band has maybe 150 members. Go figure.

Can't think of any plausible reason that Wake can't consistently have 125-135 members. AIR, we had that up until maybe 5-6 years ago.

 

[WakeBDer]

I'll just add that as folks point towards leadership and resources, it took a $10 million gift to change the UVA scatter band and put it on the path to what it is today. To grow the band by 50 folks would cost more money than most on here realize (in marketing, recruiting, scholarship, uniforms, lodging, food, travel, etc.).

 

[Deacon923]

The current size/state of the band is sad. I was there right before TSY and it was around 120 kids I think. We loved the director and it was like a family. As many have said, basketball was a big draw for the marching band and with that in the crapper for a decade it has no doubt had a negative impact.

I always wished we had more brass so I understand that comment, but the fact is you tell a player who has been playing clarinet since 6th grade that she (and it's usually a she) has to switch to trumpet or trombone or tuba, she's just going to quit the band. As a completely nonscientific guesstimate I would say you are only going to be able to convince 10% or less of woodwind players to make that switch, and if the word is out that woodwind players are not wanted they'll never sign up to begin with. So that is not the way to increase the size/sound of the band.

I will however say that the switch can be made. I switched from saxophone to brass in the 10th grade and was able to play at a marching band level very quickly. I also switched from baritone horn to tuba my sophomore year at Wake and figured that out in about a week. And I am in no way a talented musician and I was never much interested in practicing.

Going to a scramble band is an interesting idea. The powers that be at WFU would never allow it to be a Stanford style shitshow, though. It would have to be family friendly and not too edgy, which kinda takes the fun out of the scramble band concept. However watching our tiny band try to march formations is ... not great. Maybe a scramble band would be perceived as less work and more fun and we could get more kids to sign up. I don't think the new hire signed up to lead a scramble band though.

 

[RJKarl]

The current size/state of the band is sad. I was there right before TSY and it was around 120 kids I think. We loved the director and it was like a family. As many have said, basketball was a big draw for the marching band and with that in the crapper for a decade it has no doubt had a negative impact.

I always wished we had more brass so I understand that comment, but the fact is you tell a player who has been playing clarinet since 6th grade that she (and it's usually a she) has to switch to trumpet or trombone or tuba, she's just going to quit the band. As a completely nonscientific guesstimate I would say you are only going to be able to convince 10% or less of woodwind players to make that switch, and if the word is out that woodwind players are not wanted they'll never sign up to begin with. So that is not the way to increase the size/sound of the band.

I will however say that the switch can be made. I switched from saxophone to brass in the 10th grade and was able to play at a marching band level very quickly. I also switched from baritone horn to tuba my sophomore year at Wake and figured that out in about a week. And I am in no way a talented musician and I was never much interested in practicing.

Going to a scramble band is an interesting idea. The powers that be at WFU would never allow it to be a Stanford style shitshow, though. It would have to be family friendly and not too edgy, which kinda takes the fun out of the scramble band concept. However watching our tiny band try to march formations is ... not great. Maybe a scramble band would be perceived as less work and more fun and we could get more kids to sign up. I don't think the new hire signed up to lead a scramble band though.

Maybe you can come back as 1st glockenspiel.

 

[MBDeac08]

I'll just add that as folks point towards leadership and resources, it took a $10 million gift to change the UVA scatter band and put it on the path to what it is today. To grow the band by 50 folks would cost more money than most on here realize (in marketing, recruiting, scholarship, uniforms, lodging, food, travel, etc.).

Good point about the budget. Any idea how the current budget compares to a decade or so ago? Curious if it has changed much.

 

[Deacon923]

I'll just add that as folks point towards leadership and resources, it took a $10 million gift to change the UVA scatter band and put it on the path to what it is today. To grow the band by 50 folks would cost more money than most on here realize (in marketing, recruiting, scholarship, uniforms, lodging, food, travel, etc.).

But the band was about 50 people larger a decade ago. So yeah maybe we need increased investment in recruiting and scholarships, but the budget is already there for the actual operation of a larger band. WFU always ran the damn thing on a shoestring anyhow (which maybe why it's gotten to be the way it is).

 

[DeaconJoe]

But the band was about 50 people larger a decade ago. So yeah maybe we need increased investment in recruiting and scholarships, but the budget is already there for the actual operation of a larger band. WFU always ran the damn thing on a shoestring anyhow (which maybe why it's gotten to be the way it is).

I'm sure the budget was there when the band was bigger. It's not likely that a band of 80 is still being given a yearly budget to support a band of 150.

It's not a maybe thing. If you want a bigger band, you need more investment in recruiting and scholarships. That doesn't really counter the "loser" perception of band members but at least it might get students in for one year to try it out.

Not that it matters, but I bet if you asked band members if they enjoy their experience in band 80-90% would say that really enjoy it and would recommend it to others.

 

[banddeac]

Scholarships: none
Music majors: none
High school students: none
Salem/Community college kids: about 10
Budget: same as it has been for the past 20 years. When the band was bigger, the band operated on the bare minimum in order to function. With a smaller band, the members are treated better (more per diem, perks, better game day meals, etc.)
Effect of basketball: HUGE negative effect

 

[inspectah]

Scholarships: none
Music majors: none
High school students: none
Salem/Community college kids: about 10
Budget: same as it has been for the past 20 years. When the band was bigger, the band operated on the bare minimum in order to function. With a smaller band, the members are treated better (more per diem, perks, better game day meals, etc.)
Effect of basketball: HUGE negative effect

Well, there you go.

 

[Deaconblue]

Scholarships: none
Music majors: none
High school students: none
Salem/Community college kids: about 10
Budget: same as it has been for the past 20 years. When the band was bigger, the band operated on the bare minimum in order to function. With a smaller band, the members are treated better (more per diem, perks, better game day meals, etc.)
Effect of basketball: HUGE negative effect

I am surprised that there are no music majors in the marching band. Once upon a time, all instrumental music majors were required to be in marching band until graduation (usually four years). I wasn't aware that Wake had eliminated the instrumental music major. Is it still there?

I can see that the music majors at Wake are not popular. If your career goal is teaching, most K-12 jobs require pedagogy classes and student teaching experience that Wake didn't offer. So that meant another year at state teacher's U. So why go to Wake for four years, then post grad? Much easier quicker and simpler to just go to state teacher U. Performing as your goal? Better to go to a music conservatory that regularly produces national and world class instrumental players.

Lack of music majors also decreases versatility in the band. If I recall, music majors needed to be able to play multiple instruments, even if they concentrated on one.

Those players, most of the Wake band, who planned vocations in something besides music, have to fit marching band schedule in and around other Wake academics, like science labs, that tend to meet in the afternoons. The choice usually goes against marching band.

 

[banddeac]

I am surprised that there are no music majors in the marching band. Once upon a time, all instrumental music majors were required to be in marching band until graduation (usually four years). I wasn't aware that Wake had eliminated the instrumental music major. Is it still there?

I can see that the music majors at Wake are not popular. If your career goal is teaching, most K-12 jobs require pedagogy classes and student teaching experience that Wake didn't offer. So that meant another year at state teacher's U. So why go to Wake for four years, then post grad? Much easier quicker and simpler to just go to state teacher U. Performing as your goal? Better to go to a music conservatory that regularly produces national and world class instrumental players.

Lack of music majors also decreases versatility in the band. If I recall, music majors needed to be able to play multiple instruments, even if they concentrated on one.

Those players, most of the Wake band, who planned vocations in something besides music, have to fit marching band schedule in and around other Wake academics, like science labs, that tend to meet in the afternoons. The choice usually goes against marching band.

There IS a music major, but there are usually <10 annually, and they are all singers and pianists...not too helpful to the marching band. There is no music ed certification.

 

[Deacon923]

Scholarships: none
Music majors: none
High school students: none
Salem/Community college kids: about 10
Budget: same as it has been for the past 20 years. When the band was bigger, the band operated on the bare minimum in order to function. With a smaller band, the members are treated better (more per diem, perks, better game day meals, etc.)
Effect of basketball: HUGE negative effect

That's about what I figured.
Only way to a bigger better band is to fix basketball or put a lot of scholarship cash into marching band to offset the basketball suck factor. Under Ron Wellman neither occurred. So we'll see what John Currie does, but not optimistic on either front.

 

[Diggitydeac]

Do we have any mega-wealthy donors who were band members at Wake? A $10 million endowment would work wonders!

 

[WFU1977]

enough about the effing band. Give them partial scholarships. End of story.

 

[06deacon]

Yeah end of story. Easier said than done, unless you’re volunteering to help with cash?

 

[JohnToms]

Perhaps a collaboration with UNCSA? (And/or WSSU, Salem College)

 

[tsywake]

Perhaps a collaboration with UNCSA? (And/or WSSU, Salem College)

When I was in the band, we had roughly 10 Salem girls, some band, some flag core, in the band. We also had a guy from Surry CC. While we greatly appreciated their support, they weren't enough to supplement the band to levels that are needed to match ACC Schools.

Banddeac has been affiliated with the band since 1992, and knows more than we could ever wish to know. He's also one of the most respectable men I've ever known. He's advocated on my behalf more times than I can count during my time at Wake. While not the best tubaist ever known, I had a great time in the band. There are many overhauls with the band that are needed, the most as mentioned above is an influx of cash. Scholarships and incentives will go a long way to help with numbers.

 

[banddeac]

Perhaps a collaboration with UNCSA? (And/or WSSU, Salem College)

UNCSA is a music conservatory, and would frown on marching band participation for their students. WSSU has its own band. We already have Salem students.

 

[Sirdeacsalot]

just make it 100 kazoos

 

[lokisapocalypse]

When I was in the band, we had roughly 10 Salem girls, some band, some flag core, in the band. We also had a guy from Surry CC. While we greatly appreciated their support, they weren't enough to supplement the band to levels that are needed to match ACC Schools.

Banddeac has been affiliated with the band since 1992, and knows more than we could ever wish to know. He's also one of the most respectable men I've ever known. He's advocated on my behalf more times than I can count during my time at Wake. While not the best tubaist ever known, I had a great time in the band. There are many overhauls with the band that are needed, the most as mentioned above is an influx of cash. Scholarships and incentives will go a long way to help with numbers.

I think what's lost here is that all of the changes being suggested are outside of anyone's control. I don't think anyone would disagree that changes are needed but forcing people to play a new instrument or forcing music majors to be in marching band for a semester are just bandaid solutions. Those of us that did marching band did it because it was fun. Basketball certainly helped with that in my case (2001-2005) but I still did it in 2006 when I knew I was going to graduate in December. It worked out great because that was the year we won the ACC.

When people complain about the size of the band, it feels targeted at those either in band or those in charge when in reality, there isn't much they can do to improve the situation. Whether intentional or not, comments like our band is a joke and a laughingstock is insulting to those who do actively participate in it.

We've always been a small band because we're a small school. When I was there, we had the highest % of undergraduate students in marching band. I don't know if that's still the case.

3rd and 4th year members get a stipend and that's very helpful but as a new player, that seems like a far off goal. However, without additional funding from the athletic department, there's not much more the band directors can do.