• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

James Johnson

So, he's jacked, but never was a physical specimen? Aight. There's a lot of stuff going on in this thread and a lot of really idiotic comparisons.

I'll say this. Lots of scouts thought James Johnson was a lottery caliber talent. Lots of scouts thought that James Johnson put on a bit too much weight as a sophomore at Wake and pre-draft. Dude weighed in at like 6'7 260 at the combine. Whether or not he was a physical specimen - I happen to think that he was - he was the classic tweeter: wing instincts as a scorer and creator without the requisite handles and shooting touch. Fortunately, while you can't teach athleticism/size and it's really hard to teach yourself driving angles and footwork (i.e. Kobe, Wade, or Monta), you can really develop as a ball handler and as a spot up shooter. Look at Trent. Dude turned into a really solid spot up shooter as a senior. He didn't become a scorer until he started running in the D-League, but he managed to take a weakness and turn it into a strength, and became an asset to his team until he took up (earned) permanent residence in Skip's doghouse.

With Johnson, what you saw as a freshman is ultimately what you got as a player. That s really good, though. That made him an elite talent in college basketball and obviously positioned him well enough in scouts' eyes to get him drafted top-20. But he just never got better. I know it's tough to watch Sacto and Toronto, but do y'all actually think otherwise?

Whether you want to make excuses for him like he was never had potential (he did), that he wasn't a physical specimen (he was), that he wants to be an artist or fighter (umm ok?), etc. the reality is that he had a heck of a lot of ability, potential, and decision makers and staffs that believed in him and that, all of that considered, he still fell out of the NBA in four years. I attribute the fact that he couldn't improve on improvable things despite having outstanding physical tools and intangibles to work ethic.

JJ always struck me as a really good guy and he was a hell of a basketball player at Wake. Obviously, he's done really well relative to all people, relative to all basketball players, and relative to all first round picks. That's not what I was talking about. My comments are purely about what he's doing on the basketball court. If you want to stick your head in the sand about his own role in the demise of his NBA career than be my guest.

ETA: that's for you, cheesepritchard
 
Last edited:
Look like decent shape to me. If all you had to do was work hard enough and you would be Lebron or CP3, then more people would do it. CP is not in as good of shape as JJ. He just has the skillz.


tumblr_mimwhzjI6J1rspt4fo1_250.jpg

That's not the point and you know it. There are 200 players in the NBA who will never be elite, but they still find a way to turn their strengths into assets for their respective teams. I just think it's a crap excuse. If JJ worked his ass off on defense and could make a spot up jump shot, then he'd have a job right now (or be one hell of a sculptor).

JJ didn't waste any of his talent. He squandered his potential, but the talent was and is certainly still there. Hopefully he's got plenty of opportunities left to get his career back on track (or to become a hell of a sculptor).
 
To me, the modern NBA requires that you have an elite skill you can hang your hat on. The players that make it as jacks-of-all-trades with no standout skill are fewer and fewer these days. Even the ones I can think of (Chandler Parsons) have** improved their game to shoot better, rebound better, defend better, or do SOMETHING better which stacks up to NBA acceptability. James Johnson was a guy who projected to be great at least one thing, but was always a guy who was average at a bunch of things. When you look around the league, those guys rarely last for very long.

**Are there others? I like Chandler Parsons in this example because he was a 2nd round pick specifically because he had no identifiable elite skill. He was a 6'9 average athlete with wing instincts, a mediocre handle, and sketchy shooting stroke. The Rockets actually drafted him solely on the recommendations of their scouts (he was a non-Moneyball pick, basically), and the coaches later said that Chandler's teams won EVERY drill in practice. Nobody could really tell why his first year, but whenever they'd play 3v3 or 4v4, the Chandler Parsons team won.
 
Since he majored in "pre-NBA," perhaps he can go to grad school now and get a masters in "post-NBA," with a focus on unrealized potential.

Teague did this too, but none of the James Johnson tag lines worked quite as well as "Teague To The League."
 
i'm sorry he failed to meet your unrealistic expectations.
 
To me, the modern NBA requires that you have an elite skill you can hang your hat on. The players that make it as jacks-of-all-trades with no standout skill are fewer and fewer these days. Even the ones I can think of (Chandler Parsons) have** improved their game to shoot better, rebound better, defend better, or do SOMETHING better which stacks up to NBA acceptability. James Johnson was a guy who projected to be great at least one thing, but was always a guy who was average at a bunch of things. When you look around the league, those guys rarely last for very long.

**Are there others? I like Chandler Parsons in this example because he was a 2nd round pick specifically because he had no identifiable elite skill. He was a 6'9 average athlete with wing instincts, a mediocre handle, and sketchy shooting stroke. The Rockets actually drafted him solely on the recommendations of their scouts (he was a non-Moneyball pick, basically), and the coaches later said that Chandler's teams won EVERY drill in practice. Nobody could really tell why his first year, but whenever they'd play 3v3 or 4v4, the Chandler Parsons team won.

well parsons is white, so of course he just worked harder.

(ignores that he was a top 20 national recruit)
 
To me, the modern NBA requires that you have an elite skill you can hang your hat on. The players that make it as jacks-of-all-trades with no standout skill are fewer and fewer these days. Even the ones I can think of (Chandler Parsons) have** improved their game to shoot better, rebound better, defend better, or do SOMETHING better which stacks up to NBA acceptability. James Johnson was a guy who projected to be great at least one thing, but was always a guy who was average at a bunch of things. When you look around the league, those guys rarely last for very long.

**Are there others? I like Chandler Parsons in this example because he was a 2nd round pick specifically because he had no identifiable elite skill. He was a 6'9 average athlete with wing instincts, a mediocre handle, and sketchy shooting stroke. The Rockets actually drafted him solely on the recommendations of their scouts (he was a non-Moneyball pick, basically), and the coaches later said that Chandler's teams won EVERY drill in practice. Nobody could really tell why his first year, but whenever they'd play 3v3 or 4v4, the Chandler Parsons team won.

Another good post.
 
the one thing about comparing them is they were in the same HS class, and they've both put on about 35 lbs since then. one worked his butt off to make it to the league, and the other worked his butt off to stay. i'm guessing not many gator fans are saying former top recruit c. parsons isn't living up to his potential as an nba role player.
 
i'm sorry he failed to meet your unrealistic expectations.

What were your expectations? Were you predicting that he'd be an eighth man and out of the league in four years?

Nostraphandamus.
 
well parsons is white, so of course he just worked harder.

(ignores that he was a top 20 national recruit)

LOL, is this serious?

Another great example is Jimmy Butler. Wasn't a top recruit (unless you count JuCo), but I can't think of a guy who does more with what he has...

ETA: TexasDeac gets it. Great posts.

ETA: Matt Barnes, Dorrell Wright, and Martell Webster fit the bill, I think.
 
Last edited:
I did my hallmark thing and drunk posted in response to the title of this thread. Never read anything else. ENJOY THE PARSONS & JJ TALK, GUYS.
 
What were your expectations? Were you predicting that he'd be an eighth man and out of the league in four years?

Nostraphandamus.

i think i thought he'd either be a jack of all trades that stuck in the league for a long time as an 8th/9th man or be a fringe player by about now. he was either going to need to be quick enough to guard 3s or strong enough to guard 4s because his offensive skillset wasn't going to carry him. it looks like he isn't.
 
Those were my expectations. One of those guys who gets traded for every other season because a team needs a guy with his jack of all trades skillset and size.
 
LOL, is this serious?

Another great example is Jimmy Butler. Wasn't a top recruit (unless you count JuCo), but I can't think of a guy who does more with what he has...

ETA: TexasDeac gets it. Great posts.

ETA: Matt Barnes, Dorrell Wright, and Martell Webster fit the bill, I think.

yes. i am seriously asserting that the white player worked harder to get there.
 
Those were my expectations. One of those guys who gets traded for every other season because a team needs a guy with his jack of all trades skillset and size.

i think it was most people's. just because a number of wake guys exceeded expectations doesn't mean we should expect every one to. here's his espn draft profile:

Draft Analysis
The Bulls have wanted Johnson for a while. He's a good athlete who can play the 3 and the 4 on both ends of the floor. His game needs to develop, but when he gets going, he's something. He reminds me a little of Chicago's Tyrus Thomas in one way -- he'll play great one minute and have his coach pulling his hair out the next. With Thomas on the trade block, Johnson may ultimately be his replacement.
Draft Results

Player Evaluations By Chad Ford
Overall Rank 30
Position Rank 6
Hollinger PER —
Projection Lottery to mid first round
Positives
Strong, athletic
Big wingspan, great hands
Excellent athlete
Excels as a slasher
Solid shooter with some 3-point range
Hits the offensive glass
Negatives
A bit of a tweener, what position will he be in the NBA?
Old for his class
Poor shot selection
Plays out of control at times
Just as average defender
 
LOL, is this serious?

Another great example is Jimmy Butler. Wasn't a top recruit (unless you count JuCo), but I can't think of a guy who does more with what he has...

ETA: TexasDeac gets it. Great posts.

ETA: Matt Barnes, Dorrell Wright, and Martell Webster fit the bill, I think.

except he was a scorer coming out of the draft.
 
Was he? What does his profile say. I had him pegged as a prototypical glue guy, two way role player with intangibles. I didn't think he was much of a scorer, at least not moreso than JJ for instance, until his dominant performance at Portsmouth if he even is actually a scorer? I'd be interested to know what y'all think.
 
Draft Analysis
Butler will be the consummate NBA role player. He can defend multiple positions, doesn't need the ball to be effective and plays hard all of the time. He has a chance to be a very good player off the bench for the Bulls. Plus, he has one of the most amazing stories of anyone in the draft. Check it out.
Draft Results

Player Evaluations By Chad Ford
Overall Rank 29
Position Rank 8
Hollinger PER —
Projection Boston Celtics
(No. 25 Pick)
Positives
Smooth scorer
Can score inside and outside
Solid rebounder
Can be a lockdown defender
Negatives
Not a great athlete
Lacks great quickness or explosiveness
A bit of a tweener?
 
Just stopping in to say that it is tough to take seriously the opinion of someone who calls basketball a "craft". It's playing a fucking game, not designing the Statue of Liberty. Carry on.
 
the irony from a poster named strickland is strong.

i don't get the "bad shape" critique. he was never a physical specimen. i think his lack of success in the nba had more to do with doing everything ok but nothing great. it's just pretty awful that when any of those 3 come up we get "jj's lazy," "teague's a pouter and unclutch," and "afa shouldve stayed longer." give me a fucking break.

No one would admit it but it is those kind of thoughts that lead to "culture change".
 
Back
Top