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WFU Falls to 92nd in Directors' Cup Standings

palmab03 said:
I agree it sucks but is there anyone outside of message board posters who care about the Director's Cup?
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AD's and conference commissioners love to cite it when the numbers are favorable. I wonder if it bears the same importance when you're ninety fucking second?
 
That said, Wellman should be facing some heat. He built expectations for WFU athletics, and the fact is that several programs are simultaneously tanking right now, including men's hoops.

I do think that he should have the chance to get us out of this hole since WFU sports have experienced unprecedented success under his watch overall.
 
ChrisL68 said:
That said, Wellman should be facing some heat. He built expectations for WFU athletics, and the fact is that several programs are simultaneously tanking right now, including men's hoops.

I do think that he should have the chance to get us out of this hole since WFU sports have experienced unprecedented success under his watch overall.
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Right. I'm of the camp (as we all know now), that Ron Wellman shouldn't be fired. He built expectations that used to not be here, and therefore he needs to keep living up to those expectations. Just as Coach Grobe has built us up to expect a bowl game every year, our AD needs to realize that the fans expect more than we used to.
 
My assistant (a big State fan) came into my office yesterday, and in the course of signing some papers, she asked me if I was excited for the start of Wake Football. I had to honestly tell her that I wasn't nearly as excited as I have been in past years, but didn't really tell her why.

The simple fact is that the hiring and retention of Bzz and the damage he has done to our basketball program has affected my enthusiasm for all Wake sports. Wellman's role in perpetuating the charade of Bzz's competence is a major factor in this as well. He's serving us garbage and forcing us to eat it.
 
DeacLaw05 said:
My assistant (a big State fan) came into my office yesterday, and in the course of signing some papers, she asked me if I was excited for the start of Wake Football. I had to honestly tell her that I wasn't nearly as excited as I have been in past years, but didn't really tell her why.

The simple fact is that the hiring and retention of Bzz and the damage he has done to our basketball program has affected my enthusiasm for all Wake sports. Wellman's role in perpetuating the charade of Bzz's competence is a major factor in this as well. He's serving us garbage and forcing us to eat it.
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Great post. I completely agree that Bz's presence has dulled my enthusiasm for all Wake sports, not just basketball.
 
But guys, we went to the Orange Bowl in 2007! Wellman and Grobe deserve lifetime contracts. Wellman should be able to hire his friends and fire successful coaches without any explanation.... leaving the rest of the basketball world wondering WTF he was thinking.
 
To follow up on my prior post, I just renewed my Davidson basketball season tickets and couldn't be more jazzed--it is the same feeling I have had in the past for Wake Football. I'm sure that once I leave the house to head to Winston on 9/1 I'm going to be pumped, and I'm sure that I'll react to the highs and lows of a Wake Football season the same way I have in the past, but the difference this year is in the anticipation--and that is for football. We should actually be pretty good.

God help us in basketball.
 
Brendan207 said:
But guys, we went to the Orange Bowl in 2007! Wellman and Grobe deserve lifetime contracts. Wellman should be able to hire his friends and fire successful coaches without any explanation.... leaving the rest of the basketball world wondering WTF he was thinking.
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I don't think that anybody thinks this.
 
PhDeac said:
Now. Wellman had tons of capital 5 years ago.
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I don't think anybody has ever thought that it was okay for Ron Wellman to fire successful coaches and hire his friends that could coach here without any reason other than that.
 
92nd is definitely lower than is acceptable. That being said, it will always be difficult for Wake to maintain a position in the top 40 on this list. We can get there every once in a while when several teams have good years, but, we simply do not field teams in enough of the sports to be consistently high in this list - it is not reasonable to expect us to.

Our good years in the Director's Cup list are when FH wins a Natty (or goes to the final 4 umpteen years in a row), soccer wins a natty (and went to the college cup several times), baseball makes the tourney, basketball makes the tourney and maybe the 2nd round, etc. Everything has to break right for us.

IIRC, you count your top 10 men's and top 10 women's sports out of the whole list - we barely field enough teams to count - so we have to count them all. We don't have swimming&diving(m&w), wrestling, lacrosse, softball, rowing, fencing, water polo, bowling, gymnastics (m&w), ice hockey (m&w)... etc. etc.

I looked at some of the scoring info and this past winter is a good example. We scored zero Director's Cup points during the winter season. There are 15 sports counted for the winter - we field teams in exactly 4 of them - and that is counting m&w track and field, where we don't REALLY field a team. M&W basketball are the only two winter sports where we have a chance of collecting points, and we all know the state of those teams right now (the other sports are bowling, fencing, m&w gymnastics, m&w ice hockey, rifle, skiing, m&w swimming/diving, and wrestling).

Our focus needs to be on competing in the sports we field, if we do that we will naturally move up this list - but we will never be near the top. Anytime we finish in the top 30 is pretty much miraculous.
 
I just looked at the official Wake site and only see 8 men's sports listed and 8 women's sports listed. Is that right? That means we literally do not even have enough teams to count for the Director's cups - where other schools are picking their highest scoring teams to include...
 
Yes, scooter84. That has always been the case, not just now in 92nd place. It's not an excuse.
 
Right. We have exceeded expectations that most Wake fans had in the past, but they have now become expectations that we want to keep attaining. That leaves a very small margin of error. 92nd is unacceptable, but the level we achieved at for a couple of years there is also most like unlikely to be achieved again.
 
Not an excuse, Ph, an explanation. I clearly said that 92 is not acceptable - we must perform better in the sports in which we choose to participate. Unlike schools that field 12, 15 or more sports each for men and women, we have absolutely zero room for error. As such, there are going to be years like this one where we struggle to score any Director's Cup points. That is simply the reality of the law of averages. We dominated for a while in Field Hockey - now we don't. Did our coach get dumber? complacent? quit trying? I don't know.

Given our situation, where should we expect to be in the Director's Cup standings on a year-in, year-out basis? What is acceptable? I am not sure but I think you have to figure in how few teams we field and the fact that the ones we do field are the most common, popular and competitive.
 
Director's Cup standings since 2000 (Wake finishes):

2000- 50th
2001- 33rd
2002- 42nd
2003- 32nd
2004- 43rd
2005- 37th
2006- 44th
2007- 23rd
2008- 45th
2009- 37th
2010- 53rd
2011- 74th
2012- 92nd

So it seems that we sustained some very good success in there around the 40th spot. That was behind field hockey, soccer and golf success (along with basketball and football playing key roles as well). I don't think it is a stretch to say that Wake should try to finish top 40 in any given year. The 23rd ranking and 92nd are outliers as far as I'm concerned (92nd likely being the worst of the two).

I would say we should strive for 40th every year.
 
Glad you asked. Here are our Director's Cup standings for every year.

94 - 50
95 - 35
96 - 50
97 - 47
98 - 66
99 - 74
00 - 50
01 - 33
02 - 44
03 - 32
04 - 43
05 - 37
06 - 44
07 - 23
08 - 45
09 - 37
10 - 53
11 - 74
12 - 92

So you tell me. Given our situation that we have been in every year of the Director's Cup, what is acceptable to you?
 
Deacsfan27 said:
48.9 (49) is our average rank since the Cup has started.
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And that is heavily skewed by the last 2 years. The median rank is 45 and we were only lower than 50 in 5 out of the 19 years, including the last 3 years of decline.

So it's not a stretch to say we should be consistently in the 35-50 range.

Edit: I originally said 40-50 range, but I went back to the numbers to see that we finished better than 40 in 6 seasons so it's not much of a stretch.
 
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That is consistent with what I was saying. We should expect to be top 50, usually closer to 40, with a great year pushing us higher every once in a while. But, we should not be shocked when we have a bad year and fall much lower - with no room for error, it is going to happen.

We should be looking for trends - the last two years are very poor, where do we go next year? And, we should be looking for details - where were we earning points before but have failed to do so in the last two years? What changed? Where do we have the potential to score points? Where are coaching changes needed? Where will the addition of resources likely yield benefits?
 
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