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According to Dan

We made no offensive adjustments at the half. Game over.
 
thewakedeacon said:
You guys are killing Tanner.

First thing, Wake sucks as developing QBs. Back in the day when Jeff Mullen was coaching QBs we would have guys transfer out and start elsewhere. Second, In Tanner's 4 years here at Wake the run game has sucked. Week after week we all complain about our running game. A QB can't produce if the defense knows what the offense is going to do.

Saying all that, Tanner has played piss poor some games but it's not all on him.
A QB is only as good as the talent and coaching around him..

Blocking as a whole
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Really that's the biggest problem. I mean we can talk about making bad throws or dropping balls or a RB going down too easy, but the one constant in football despite all the spread offenses and such, is it all starts up front and we just haven't been even decent up front for awhile. If we had a good O-line, Tanner would look a lot better, the RB's would look a lot better, and the WR's would look a lot better.
 
Not to mention the drive crushing penalties by the line.
 
DCDeac said:
Tanner's 3rd in the ACC in completions and fourth in yards with only 5 picks. He has one legitimate target to go along with a weak running game and a poor offensive line. As a sophomore he threw for 3,000 yards with only 6 picks.

Of all the issues Wake has, Tanner is nowhere near the top of the list. Solid ACC QB who has been asked to do way too much for teams with gaping holes. I think some posters should review Riley's numbers before praising him while skewering Tanner.
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i forget the psych term, it's a human bias where you view the past as more rosy than it was. that nostalgia is going on right now with the skinner v price comparisons. both were good QBs. Skinner obviously had way more talent around him and a hungry grobe.

riley was definitely awesome though.
 
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DirkTheDeac said:
Not to mention the drive crushing penalties by the line.
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Penalties were certainly a killer Saturday as well. That's another thing that doesn't speak well of the staff, we used to be known as a disciplined team that didn't beat itself. Now, not so much.
 
I'm all for bashing the ineptitude of our coaching staff for trying to turn Tanner into an option QB and possibly blowing our bowl game this year, but I don't get the argument that Riley wasn't developed well as a QB. They kept the game plans simple and the throws easy when he had to take over as a freshman, leaned on the defense and kicking game instead of calling 25 yard posts on 3rd and long. By his senior year he was among the best in the ACC and threw for 3,000+ yards and got a look in the NFL. Compare that to where he was coming out of Bolles - I suspect he'd give a nice long talk to anyone who would argue he wasn't developed well at Wake by Grobe and company.
 
dmcheatw said:
i forget the psych term, it's a human bias where you view the past as more rosy than it was. that nostalgia is going on right now with the skinner v price comparisons. both were good QBs. Skinner obviously had way more talent around him and a hungry grobe.
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You can spin it whatever way you want, but Riley was much more accurate and clutch than Tanner. Other than Kenny Moore, what other great receiver did Riley have? For Tanner's first 2 years he had 2 of the best receivers Wake has even had in Camp and Givens and he's had Camp his last 2 years. Sure, the team's during Riley's years had more talent, but more so on the defensive side I think. Did Riley have the benefit of a great running back or great offensive line?
 
liveanddiedeac said:
You can spin it whatever way you want, but Riley was much more accurate and clutch than Tanner. Other than Kenny Moore, what other great receiver did Riley have? For Tanner's first 2 years he had 2 of the best receivers Wake has even had in Camp and Givens and he's had Camp his last 2 years. Sure, the team's during Riley's years had more talent, but more so on the defensive side I think. Did Riley have the benefit of a great running back or great offensive line?
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He had a first team all America tackle watching his back, so, yeah, Riley had it pretty good in 2006.
 
DirkTheDeac said:
He had a first team all America tackle watching his back, so, yeah, Riley had it pretty good in 2006.
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He didn't have a great O-line, certainly didn't have a great running back. There's no doubt we had more talent, but don't act like he had an offense full All-ACC players either.

I can remember Riley running for his life plenty of times back there too, the thing I don't remember is as many balls getting thrown in the dirt while running as I do with Tanner.
 
liveanddiedeac said:
He didn't have a great O-line, certainly didn't have a great running back. There's no doubt we had more talent, but don't act like he had an offense full All-ACC players either.
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Our Oline in 2006 was so much better than what we have now it's not really worth debating. I'll leave it at that.
 
liveanddiedeac said:
He didn't have a great O-line, certainly didn't have a great running back. There's no doubt we had more talent, but don't act like he had an offense full All-ACC players either.

I can remember Riley running for his life plenty of times back there too, the thing I don't remember is as many balls getting thrown in the dirt while running as I do with Tanner.
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Justice and Vallos?
 
Well they both spent time in the NFL. How many offensive linemen has Tanner had that spent time in the NFL? Looney is the only one right?
 
liveanddiedeac said:
You can spin it whatever way you want, but Riley was much more accurate and clutch than Tanner. Other than Kenny Moore, what other great receiver did Riley have? For Tanner's first 2 years he had 2 of the best receivers Wake has even had in Camp and Givens and he's had Camp his last 2 years. Sure, the team's during Riley's years had more talent, but more so on the defensive side I think. Did Riley have the benefit of a great running back or great offensive line?
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yeah i agree, check the edit. I didn't mean to down play Riley. I'd like to have him now.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Well they both spent time in the NFL. How many offensive linemen has Tanner had that spent time in the NFL? Looney is the only one right?
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That's a very valid point. Like i stated above, the Oline has been our biggest weakness. Tanner certainly would've had more success with a better Oline. I just don't think Riley played on teams that were terribly talented on offense either, but they were certainly better.

Edited to add: I do think those teams had more guys on offense that had the ability to step up when needed. You can look back and see where guys like Willie Idolette or Kevin Marion or Nate Morton,etc. would make plays that frankly guys not named Camp don't make for us now.
 
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I think the most obvious answer is that the difference between wins is largely attributable to both a better offensive line with Skinner and a considerably better defense when Skinner was here.

Average ranks for Skinner's four years (2006-2009): 74th in scoring offense, 83rd in total offense; 30th in scoring defense, 32nd in total defense

Average ranks for Price's four years (2010-2013): 98th in scoring offense, 106th in total offense; 73rd in scoring defense, 75th in total defense.

It is interesting to note though that Wake has been in the bottom 15 teams in total offense three of the four years that Tanner has been QB.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
I think the most obvious answer is that the difference between wins is largely attributable to both a better offensive line with Skinner and a considerably better defense when Skinner was here.

Average ranks for Skinner's four years (2006-2009): 74th in scoring offense, 83rd in total offense; 30th in scoring defense, 32nd in total defense

Average ranks for Price's four years (2010-2013): 98th in scoring offense, 106th in total offense; 73rd in scoring defense, 75th in total defense.

It is interesting to note though that Wake has been in the bottom 15 teams in total offense three of the four years that Tanner has been QB.
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The thing with Riley though, is he seemed to have the ability to step up and lead a drive when we needed him to. Tanner just hasn't shown that. Last year against UNC he did and I had hoped maybe that would give him the confidence to be able to do it more often. Don't get me wrong, Riley had bad games, who can forget the 4 or 5 interception game against Navy, but for the most part Riley was pretty clutch. Again though, it's easier to be clutch when you've at least got a decent offensive line.


I think another answer for that is the coaching philosophy. Grobe is a defense, kicking game, play it close to the vest coach. Hard to be an offensive juggernaut with a top down philosophy like that.
 
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DCDeac said:
I'm all for bashing the ineptitude of our coaching staff for trying to turn Tanner into an option QB and possibly blowing our bowl game this year, but I don't get the argument that Riley wasn't developed well as a QB. They kept the game plans simple and the throws easy when he had to take over as a freshman, leaned on the defense and kicking game instead of calling 25 yard posts on 3rd and long. By his senior year he was among the best in the ACC and threw for 3,000+ yards and got a look in the NFL. Compare that to where he was coming out of Bolles - I suspect he'd give a nice long talk to anyone who would argue he wasn't developed well at Wake by Grobe and company.
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Strong post.
 
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