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Charleston Church Shooting

Who is saying we need more guns? I certainly didn't say that. All I said is that I understand how someone could feel it appropriate to carry one in light of these types of massacres. I don't even own a gun. This tragedy is not about guns, it is about mental illness and hate. If he didn't have a gun he could have made a bomb and threw it in the church. There are always ways to mass destruct.
 
Wrangor said:
Who is saying we need more guns? I certainly didn't say that. All I said is that I understand how someone could feel it appropriate to carry one in light of these types of massacres. I don't even own a gun. This tragedy is not about guns, it is about mental illness and hate. If he didn't have a gun he could have made a bomb and threw it in the church. There are always ways to mass destruct.
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So much for turning the other cheek.


Go with Christ.
 
The board is just dying to pick a fight. I don't speak on astrophysics because I don't study it. Its funny how that never works with the Bible. Those most skeptical are also the most sure about their opinion on it. Cherry pick a few select passages and you have all the ammo you need. Congrats.
 


Alright - honest dialogue. I agree with Stewart for the most part on his rant. He makes a lot of great points. My question to the boards is....what steps can we take close the racial wound? What steps can we take that would have prevented this depraved young man trying to kill black people. Stewart mentions the confederate flag and road names, and I am not sure that is a real solution. Is taking a road sign down going to change this young man's mind? Is a confederate flag flying at a confederate war memorial going to cause a young man to kill 9 people? I am just not sure on that.

As much as the north likes to forget, the south weren't the only states to have slaves, and the south wasn't just fighting about slavery. Sure it was intermixed, but the Civil War was about a lot more than just slavery. The Emancipation proclamation didn't end slavery. It ended slavery IN THE STATES IN REBELLION. The south was already in rebellion when Lincoln issued the proclamation. The border states that Lincoln wanted to keep in the fold were able to keep their slaves.

Again, I am not arguing with Stewart on the scenario we currently face, just not sure on the solutions. Would love to hear some thoughts. I think he brought up a great dose of reality, and then afterwards settled into a lot of platitudes and stereotypes without offering any real solutions. We have real problems. We have real hurts in the past. But how can we marginalize those who hate anyone that doesn't look like them.
 
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I just read that over half of this guys friends in Facebook were black. That seems strange.
 
TownieDeac said:
There is no racial wound. Until black people solve the problems in their own communities, we can't move forward. If I've read it once on these boards, I've read it a million times.
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Why can't it be both? I shouldn't have to state this, but I have never said the above quote, and think it is ridiculous, but why we can't we call for both?
 
Wrangor said:
Who is saying we need more guns? I certainly didn't say that. All I said is that I understand how someone could feel it appropriate to carry one in light of these types of massacres. I don't even own a gun. This tragedy is not about guns, it is about mental illness and hate. If he didn't have a gun he could have made a bomb and threw it in the church. There are always ways to mass destruct.
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So obtuse

This 21-year old, deranged kid (with several recent run-ins with law enforcement) went in and purchased a fire arm in the context of system that is outdated by roughly 250 years. A 10 minute check (hell 1 minute if you had checked his facebook page) would have given some indication that selling this kid a gun probably wasn't the best idea in the world. But yeah, this tragedy isn't about guns.
 
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The shooter almost didn't do it because the victims were so nice to him.

You piece of shit.

As to what we do about the rift, the first thing is to stop allowing it to get worse. Politicians like Jesse Helms used race to fire up his base to stay elected. There was plenty of racism against Obama that wasn't called out by the party.

Heck, Jahn McCain was lauded because he had the courage to say Obama isn't a Muslim and is a decent guy.
 
IMissRandolph said:
So obtuse
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You think it is? This tragedy is about hate, not guns. Guns were just the vehicle for the hate. Hate always finds a vehicle. I don't say that as a way to say we shouldn't have gun laws (we should). I have no problem with stricter gun laws to be honest. But this attack isn't about guns. It is about racism and hate.
 
bym051d said:
The shooter almost didn't do it because the victims were so nice to him.

You piece of shit.

As to what we do about the rift, the first thing is to stop allowing it to get worse. Politicians like Jesse Helms used race to fire up his base to stay elected. There was plenty of racism against Obama that wasn't called out by the party.

Heck, Jahn McCain was lauded because he had the courage to say Obama isn't a Muslim and is a decent guy.
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Is that directed at me? Where did that come from? I was responding Townie's sarcastic response as if there are no problems that need to be solved in the black community. This tragedy had ZERO to do with any sort of problems in the black community. Perhaps I should have clarified that, but Townie brought up the issue as if it was crazy for someone to discuss problems both within and without. Calm your tone man.
 
Wrangor said:
Who is saying we need more guns? I certainly didn't say that. All I said is that I understand how someone could feel it appropriate to carry one in light of these types of massacres. I don't even own a gun. This tragedy is not about guns, it is about mental illness and hate. If he didn't have a gun he could have made a bomb and threw it in the church. There are always ways to mass destruct.
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I am assuming that you do not contest the fact that gun violence of the type that occurs in the US is an anomaly compared to the figures that come out of other wealthy countries. So my question to you--- Are Americans more mentally ill and full of hate than people in other countries? I doubt it. It seems clear to me that there are a lot of deranged people in the US who have greater access to the means to inflict mass harm than in other countries. I believe that these coward weirdo white kids wouldn't be committing these mass shootings if they were actually difficult to pull off. The Columbine kids built a ton of bombs to use in their attack... and none went off. Because building bombs is kind of hard relative to your Dad just giving you a handgun for your birthday. If they are really freaking crazy then they might show up with a knife and some garage made bombs, but their capacity to harm would be greatly reduced. I think you err when you discount the importance of these crazies having the opportunity to pull off their deranged plans. Without the opportunity that readily available guns provide weirdos like the guy who shot up the movie theatre don't get to have their fantasies fueled by how easy it would be to just . . .
 
Wrangor said:
You think it is? This tragedy is about hate, not guns. Guns were just the vehicle for the hate. Hate always finds a vehicle. I don't say that as a way to say we shouldn't have gun laws (we should). I have no problem with stricter gun laws to be honest. But this attack isn't about guns. It is about racism and hate.
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Hate finds a vehicle, but it's a whole lot easier to kill a lot of people with a gun than a knife.
 
Wrangor said:
Is that directed at me? Where did that come from? I was responding Townie's sarcastic response as if there are no problems that need to be solved in the black community. This tragedy had ZERO to do with any sort of problems in the black community. Perhaps I should have clarified that, but Townie brought up the issue as if it was crazy for someone to discuss problems both within and without. Calm your tone man.
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Nope. Directed at the shooter. I try to quote the person I'm speaking to.
 
Turning this debate into a gun control debate is missing the point. Sorry. It isn't addressing the root problem, it is putting cortizone on the rash to make it disappear. Problem is the rash is going to come back unless you address the root problem.
 
Wrangor said:
Turning this debate into a gun control debate is missing the point. Sorry. It isn't addressing the root problem, it is putting cortizone on the rash to make it disappear. Problem is the rash is going to come back unless you address the root problem.
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It continues to be this "it's not a gun issue" crap and defiance in the face of evidence clearly suggesting the opposite that simply amazes me. Like others have said, when events like this and Sandy Hook don't impart significant change with our antiquated gun laws, I don't know what will.
 
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