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Conference Realignment Thread: New B1G divisions

vadimivich said:
You guys are living under a rock if you don't think that the football schools in the ACC (FSU, GT, Clemson in particular) aren't very unhappy with the current state of the ACC leadership and the apparent basketball bias led by the "Big 4" NC schools. You can find strong resentment on every single message board, and it's been there for years. This catastrophically bad TV deal (and make no mistake, for the schools that compete directly against SEC rivals this is nothing but another confirmation of minor league status) is going to just raise the temperature on that discontent even higher. There is no question that Swofford's power base is the Big 4 and UVa, and there's no question he's been an abject failure as commissioner. The natives are very, very restless and it could blow this conference apart at the seams. If the NC schools want to stay relevant, they need to appease the football schools and feeding Swofford to the fishes and getting a new commissioner with zero ties to the NC schools would be a huge head start in that area - but that's never going to happen.

GT has no interest in Big 12, and would probably prefer to stay in the ACC ... but there's no question that a substantially large portion of the fanbase and boosters would bite off Delaney's arm if he extended a B1G invite, and the academic staff would go along happily. In fact, if FSU continues to flirt like this with the Big 12, the quiet GT to the B1G talk is going to get louder and louder. I think you'll see Maryland (another school whose fans and boosters despise the current ACC leadership) really amp up their flirting with the B1G as well.

Wake and Duke stand the most to lose in this entire process. Backing the wrong horse (Swofford and the rest of the "Big 4" cronies) could be fatal.
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Obviously, these clowns are Chelsea fans, too.
 
vadimivich said:
I guess what I don't get about this thread (and ones I see at the UNC and Duke forums) is that every poster from Clemson, FSU and GT explains that their fanbases are unhappy. The response is "STFU, you shouldn't be". It's like having a girlfriend who tells you she's unhappy all the time, you tell her why she shouldn't be but don't change anything and then one day you are stunned when she leaves you. It's just dumb.

If all the football schools are unhappy ... maybe the league should take a serious look at what needs to be done to make them happy. Or it should just accept becoming the Big East 2.0.
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Almost every decision in the last 15 years (if not 20) was made for the football schools. What other things do they want the conference to do that they are not currently? Do those football schools realize that their own mediocrity is killing the value of the brand? Some accountability there would be nice. The "football" schools aren't happy. So what will make them happy?

I get them bitching about too many ACC championships of any sort in NC. However, those things haven't always faired that well in locations for the other schools to support. You know what is worse than not moving it around more...empty seats. Agree with the poster that said blaming the big 4 is antiquated and just not accurate in the current ACC.

My only real complaint on the business side is that the league should have already gone down the road with its own network. Given the fading value of the brand, I can see why some felt it necessary to gain the distribution advantage with ESPN.
 
vadimivich said:
I guess what I don't get about this thread (and ones I see at the UNC and Duke forums) is that every poster from Clemson, FSU and GT explains that their fanbases are unhappy. The response is "STFU, you shouldn't be". It's like having a girlfriend who tells you she's unhappy all the time, you tell her why she shouldn't be but don't change anything and then one day you are stunned when she leaves you. It's just dumb.

If all the football schools are unhappy ... maybe the league should take a serious look at what needs to be done to make them happy. Or it should just accept becoming the Big East 2.0.
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Except this is more like a guy with 12 wives and like four of the them think everyone should do things their way because they were kinda hot 20 years ago and they might leave even though the reluctance to change is due to their own failures. Keep up the crazy talk of leaving. Nobody better even wants you.

I have an idea....if you want the conference to be football first then stop being mediocre at best nationally at football and that applies to all the football first schools. If you think the ACC turned down a better deal so some more basketball games would be on tv you are a fucking moron. The ACC got the best deal you can when your "football" schools cannot compete on a national level so you rely on your basketball heritage to drive the deal.
 
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I don't understand why a basketball focused conference would add BC, Virginia Tech, and Miami. Yeah, obviously Syracuse and Pitt are basketball first these days, but they have had more recent success (past 15-20 years) in football than the first three had in basketball.

I can understand why FSU and Clemson are unhappy with the revenue, but they need to look at themselves. These deals are all about the schools at the top, not at the bottom, and the top of the ACC has been putrid (and FSU and Clemson have largely been mia) the past few years. And, even if they are unhappy with the revenue, independence isn't an option so what matters here are the alternatives. The Big 12 is not a great long term alternative for FSU or Clemson. The SEC is, but neither FSU nor Clemson bring much to the table for them.
 
Oh, and let's remember that the fans don't make these decisions, not even close. What is said on a message board isn't going to reflect what the leadership will do on such a long term decision. Just for example, I bet Miami fans are bitching about the ACC too, but I can't see their leadership giving it even a second thought (not that they are an attractive target anyway).
 
The whole fervor over third tier rights is also absurd. The Longhorn Network is carried by one cable provider. One. A shitty football game and two or three shitty basketball games aren't worth hardly anything if you aren't Ohio State, Texas, Michigan, Florida, etc. FSU nor Clemson are in that company.
 
I don't know all the votes on all matters, but you don't have to look hard to see that Wake has made numerous decisions in the last 8-10 years for the sole purpose of betterment of the ACC and its football product (and inherently our own football product).

One thing our administration seems to have understood well is that we are now in a football centric world. We voted FOR expansion in 2003 without any prodding - the reason, the ACC needed to improve the football product...UNC and Duke did not care and still voted no (don't remember State for sure, I know there was some flip flopping, but with a specific reason as I recall).

Wake has also made every decision internally possible to benefit our program and show a commitment to football...yes that was done in an effort to improve our program overall, but it also helps the ACC in that it doesn't appear the ACC has multiple programs that "don't care" and "aren't trying" in football.

While national success is much more likely for Wake on the basketball stage everything from facilities to coach salaries, etc. really illustrate that we have morphed into a football first school in terms of resources...many will say that is faulty, but our livelihood in major college athletics at the HIGHEST level depends on the ACC remaining a strong conference, and as such in this particular landscape, spending on football and voting with a football centric mind in ACC matters makes sense.

So I don't think Wake's head is in the sand at all in regards to the football schools and what they want, and thus I don't think we are voting to protect the interest of basketball first schools...nothing in our recent history suggests such...logic actually says we should be voting with the football schools every single time unless it creates a grossly unfair outcome specifically for Wake.

The ACC made a huge mistake in IMO when they didn't beat the Big Ten to the punch in starting a conference network --- at one time ACC basketball was soo very coveted and Olympic sports were almost totally unavailble with no ESPN3, online programming, etc. --- the ACC could have easily started a very profitable network, but was too comfortable with Raycom it appears.

A Larry Scott type instead of the goold ole boy network for ACC Commissioner would have served the ACC well --- now the brand is damaged to a certain degree, and while starting a network still might be warranted within the ESPN framework, it has missed the potential for wild carriage success and lots of dollars directly into ACC schools' pockets.
 
vadimivich said:
Even little things like the ACC Tournament and the ACC CG both being played in the state of NC rub people the wrong way, even if you can make good, objective cases for why they are located there. Lefty drove around the state of NC with the ACCT trophy on the hood of his car for a reason.

Look, I grew up in NC as the son of UNC alumni. I chose to go to GT because I wanted a school involved with ACC athletics. I understand a lot of the reasoning from both sides. But the cold reality is that the wedge between the basketball schools and the football schools has gotten bigger and bigger and it's going to blow this conference to pieces if it isn't addressed, and soon.
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Vad, you went to GT, so I respect your opinion on the subject. I work there and know no one who wouldn't be depressed if GT went to the B10, save students from the midwest. Are these yankee alums who are interested in the B10? SEC yes, B12 to a certain extent, but I've never heard anyone pining for Delanyland.
 
TBR said:
The whole fervor over third tier rights is also absurd. The Longhorn Network is carried by one cable provider. One. A shitty football game and two or three shitty basketball games aren't worth hardly anything if you aren't Ohio State, Texas, Michigan, Florida, etc. FSU nor Clemson are in that company.
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And especially GT. Their fanbase is about as delusional as they come.
 
ChrisL68 said:
And especially GT. Their fanbase is about as delusional as they come.
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Perhaps, but Georgia's is even more delusional. What have they won for their fans to be so arrogant? If not for Hershel Walker 30 years ago, the answer would be nothing.
 
raf44 said:
How about this- If the football schools want SEC money, they should win at an SEC level. I see no reason why FSU, Clemson, and GT should earn as much as UF, USC, and UGA when the latter schools have been consistently outperforming them for years.
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Interesting since the last 3 games FSU has played vs. those teams UF twice and SC once in the peach bowl have all be lopsided FSU victories.
 
I am just flabbergasted that somebody would suggest that the ACCCG being in Charlotte is some evidence of NC bias. We tried it in Jax and Tampa. Attendance was terrible. Our conference was a national laughingstock. We moved it to Charlotte and the attendance was fine.
 
ACC did the right thing by moving to Charlotte although I would rather just play it at the homefield of the team with best record.
 
vadimivich said:
I guess what I don't get about this thread (and ones I see at the UNC and Duke forums) is that every poster from Clemson, FSU and GT explains that their fanbases are unhappy. The response is "STFU, you shouldn't be". It's like having a girlfriend who tells you she's unhappy all the time, you tell her why she shouldn't be but don't change anything and then one day you are stunned when she leaves you. It's just dumb.

If all the football schools are unhappy ... maybe the league should take a serious look at what needs to be done to make them happy. Or it should just accept becoming the Big East 2.0.
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I don't like this analogy at all.

The situation is more like a relationship where a HS grad is making a decent amount of money, but his college-educated wife is a stay-at-home mom, and she is complaining that they can't afford all the new toys the Jones' down the street are buying.

If the wife is unhappy with the family's financial situation, maybe she should get a job. She is the one with the earning potential. Divorce is not the answer.

In other words, forgetting the analogy, Wake (and Duke, and UNC) fans are simply saying that the problem (lack of TV revenue) is the fault of the very schools that are complaining (FSU and Miami more so that GT), not incompetence from Swofford or some North Carolina bias.
 
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vad, can you explain why FSU, GT, and Clemson fans don't understand that the ACC TV deal matches the quality of ACC football?
 
stonevilleicetea said:
ACC did the right thing by moving to Charlotte although I would rather just play it at the homefield of the team with best record.
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That makes no sense. If one team has a significantly easier division/schedule, why should they be further rewarded with a home game? Please.
 
stonevilleicetea said:
Interesting since the last 3 games FSU has played vs. those teams UF twice and SC once in the peach bowl have all be lopsided FSU victories.
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paging small sample size deac.

The ACC was counting on FSU and Miami being dominant in Football, and they've both been very disappointing. This is a pretty weird time for that fanbase to be complaining about the conference.
 
Yep. Divisions were set up and the ACCCG was in Jacksonville specifically for FSU-Miami matchups. There's a reason why FSU is on one side and VT and Miami are on the other. Swofford and the ACC brass thought it would be those 3 teams competing for titles and they didn't want them on the same side. FSU was placed at the top of what was thought to be the weaker division so they could dominate and their fans would head to Jacksonville to see a Miami rematch or a game against VT. The ACC bent over backwards for FSU, but FSU didn't take advantage of it.
 
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