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Danny Manning Credibility Watch

Pretty hard to complain about the coaching tonite. Against a HOF coach using a challenging defense, we had the right game plan and executed well even after losing our leading scorer.
 
Deac83 said:
Danny gets some cred today. Had the strategy to beat the zone. Craw in the middle. I'm guessing some one else was supposed to be there when craw was out. Probably example of some players executing to the plan and some not .
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Woods. Looked like it was supposed to be Crawford or Woods in the middle.
 
wfumike02 said:
Couldn't agree more. We do well in conference and all anyone will notice about the shitty start is how much the team improved.
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If we play well in conference, the devil's advocate observation is how much the OOC disaster torpedoed an opportunity for a legitimate postseason. See also: 2017 LA Chargers.
 
Why do many of y'all act like when we stop executing a previously successful gameplan mid-game that our coaches or players just decided to do something else?

Clearly our opponents changed up their strategy to counter ours. We didn't just decide that we don't like winning.
 
wakephan09 said:
Why do many of y'all act like when we stop executing a previously successful gameplan mid-game that our coaches or players just decided to do something else?

Clearly our opponents changed up their strategy to counter ours. We didn't just decide that we don't like winning.
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Honestly, in this game, it was a little more of the former. Partially because the personnel in the game couldn't run it as effectively as the starting 5 (a) Without Moore in, the man at the FT line didn't have the option of the lob/dunk, which also allowed the 5 to cheat up a little into his face of the man at the FT line without worrying as much about the lob. b) others weren't as effective as Crawford in the middle because of lack of court vision and Crawford slipped outside the 3 line and into the middle rather than flashing from the block to the middle like Thompson et al which creates different spacing issues, although Thompson did do a good job of taking the open 14 footer when given to him).

We also stopped looking at the FT line for much of the time of our bad stretch, passing along the perimeter and settling for a 3 rather than working the plan. Part of that was the lack of patience of the man at the FT, abandoning the position early - also a little of that is on Wilbekin and Chill, whose height and game aren't conducive to attacking the zone at the center point and they seemed content to play on the perimeter and look for a shot or opening to drive. Yes, adjustments shifted the windows in the zone, but we were content to let that dictate our strategy - we started playing we again, not so much because of a counter-adjustment, but by re-establishing and re-committing to the original game plan.
 
wfumike02 said:
Couldn't agree more. We do well in conference and all anyone will notice about the shitty start is how much the team improved.
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Agree. It will suck to miss the tourney with those early horrific losses, but this team could definitely win 9 or 10 games in conference. And we only get better (much better) with added experience and our new additions next year.
 
Deac83 said:
Danny gets some cred today. Had the strategy to beat the zone. Craw in the middle. I'm guessing some one else was supposed to be there when craw was out. Probably example of some players executing to the plan and some not .
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Thompson was also going to the middle
 
IamThunderbolt said:
Honestly, in this game, it was a little more of the former. Partially because the personnel in the game couldn't run it as effectively as the starting 5 (a) Without Moore in, the man at the FT line didn't have the option of the lob/dunk, which also allowed the 5 to cheat up a little into his face of the man at the FT line without worrying as much about the lob. b) others weren't as effective as Crawford in the middle because of lack of court vision and Crawford slipped outside the 3 line and into the middle rather than flashing from the block to the middle like Thompson et al which creates different spacing issues, although Thompson did do a good job of taking the open 14 footer when given to him).

We also stopped looking at the FT line for much of the time of our bad stretch, passing along the perimeter and settling for a 3 rather than working the plan. Part of that was the lack of patience of the man at the FT, abandoning the position early - also a little of that is on Wilbekin and Chill, whose height and game aren't conducive to attacking the zone at the center point and they seemed content to play on the perimeter and look for a shot or opening to drive. Yes, adjustments shifted the windows in the zone, but we were content to let that dictate our strategy - we started playing we again, not so much because of a counter-adjustment, but by re-establishing and re-committing to the original game plan.
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Did any of you watch the Boeheim post-game presser? He said, in so many words, that our plan to beat their zone was working so well "we took that away." So I think that pretty much is the end of the debate on this issue.
 
These are just raw numbers for Manning years:

Recruiting ranking average: 61 (w/o 2018), 51.6 (w/ 2018)
Kenpom AdjEm average: 85.5

BUT, these numbers are incredibly misleading. The most important stat I see that I just gathered is that the recruiting average for Manning leading into the 2016-17 season was 68.66 (2014-2016). The Kenpom ranking for that team with the average 68.66 recruiting ranking was 36 to end the year.

So, last year Manning's coaching ability, and likely talent evaluation, led us to be just over 30 spots better than our recruiting average.

IMPORTANT NOTE: The 2014 class on 247 does not include Dinos Mitoglou so I got creative with this alternative scneario. I decided that Dinos would be ranked around where Olivier is on 247 (193, 85 rating - which I think is pretty generous out of high school for Dinos). This changed the overall recruiting ranking average for manning to be 59.33. Therefore, even in this scenario Manning coached our guys to be 23.33 spots better on KP than our recruiting rankings indicate we should be.

ETA: I did this really quickly so if someone wants to spot check to see if I made a mistake then please feel free. This would seem to indicate that Manning is indeed good at coaching basketball though so I'm sorry to some of the h8ers.

EATA: Reposted this here because it applies.
 
To me it looked like Boeheim had to pull his zone in and stop being as aggressive on the wings to prevent the middle entry pass and to stay closer to the baseline guy (Dorale). But it left the wings open. Wilbekin just threw the ball to them once trying to get it into the free throw line. Then again, we hit three consecutive 3’s from the corner wing that really turned the game around. Typically that’s a dead trap for their zone but we were hurting them inside too much.

When you open a game with like 3 casual dunks it definitely evokes an “oh shit this isn’t going to work against a true 7 footer” reaction.
 
We need to chart credibility after each game. Dropped after unc back up after Cuse
 
What if we hired Dino as interim coach and then followed with Tony Bennett? That's a fun alternative reality.
 
Wonder if Manning has heard of the shuffle offense? The 1-4? Any type of set plays?
 
wfu22fan said:
Wonder if Manning has heard of the shuffle offense? The 1-4? Any type of set plays?
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We get it - you hate Manning. But if you’re going to complain about something complain about something we’re bad at. Your constant barrage on the offense just shows you have no idea how basketball works or have any basis in fact in your arguments. We were the 7th best offense last year and 37th this year. I’m pretty sure Manning knows plenty about offensive sets
 
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