• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

Danny Manning Credibility Watch

Again, Manning did a great job with the incoming class. He’s brought talent to Wake we didn’t have with the previous coach. He had the misfortune of his best player leaving after two years, and another critical piece leaving unexpectedly. I was wrong about how big of a loss Dinos was. Dead wrong, and I don’t mind admitting it. I’d like to see what happens next year. If it doesn’t go well- and with Sarr Brown Mucius and Hoard I expect being in the NCAA tournament and very competitive in the ACC- it’s time to go. I like Pat Kelsey.
 
Yep, we all were wrong about how big a loss Dinos was- this team needs some upper class leadership to close out games.... and we have none. :(
 
wakelaw13 said:
Again, Manning did a great job with the incoming class. He’s brought talent to Wake we didn’t have with the previous coach. He had the misfortune of his best player leaving after two years, and another critical piece leaving unexpectedly. I was wrong about how big of a loss Dinos was. Dead wrong, and I don’t mind admitting it. I’d like to see what happens next year. If it doesn’t go well- and with Sarr Brown Mucius and Hoard I expect being in the NCAA tournament and very competitive in the ACC- it’s time to go. I like Pat Kelsey.
Click to expand...

I agree with all of this. We’re severely missing a wing and we’re getting two in Hoard and Mucius next year. I don’t know what has happened to our shot making ability but it’s completely gone. Our guards just are not good enough to carry the team. Moore and Sarr have come along really nicely, and I think will make a good team with Hoard, Chaundee, and Crawford/Chill. That gives you five players who can actually play both offense and defense. If Manning cannot succeed with next years team then he should go. We should not have any gaping holes in our lineups next season like we do right now.
 
^ you guys are high if you think we are making the tournament next year. Look at Chaundee - he is totally lost out there. You think more freshman are the (immediate) answer? We’re a couple years away at best
 
CharlotteDeac1 said:
I agree with all of this. We’re severely missing a wing and we’re getting two in Hoard and Mucius next year. I don’t know what has happened to our shot making ability but it’s completely gone. Our guards just are not good enough to carry the team. Moore and Sarr have come along really nicely, and I think will make a good team with Hoard, Chaundee, and Crawford/Chill. That gives you five players who can actually play both offense and defense. If Manning cannot succeed with next years team then he should go. We should not have any gaping holes in our lineups next season like we do right now.
Click to expand...

We all should be excited about the freshmen/incoming freshmen’s potential, but your post above is just based on that, potential. Sarr and Brown haven’t shown they are/can be top-half ACC level starters, and Hoard isn’t a particularly good shooter, which is a pretty key part of the game (I think). It’s wild to think of Moore as our most legit ACC-level player at his position, but he is IMHO.
 
tigerswood said:
We all should be excited about the freshmen/incoming freshmen’s potential, but your post above is just based on that, potential. Sarr and Brown haven’t shown they are/can be top-half ACC level starters, and Hoard isn’t a particularly good shooter, which is a pretty key part of the game (I think). It’s wild to think of Moore as our most legit ACC-level player at his position, but he is IMHO.
Click to expand...

Chaundeac was rated almost as high as Hoard and has trouble getting off of Manning's bench. I am sure we will have a transfer or injury or some such that will make it "impossible" to be competitive next year.

But the year after that...
 
I actually think it’s pretty simple. We were a really good shooting team last year because teams had to respect our inside game. Woods and Arians feasted on soft defenses guarding the post and passes inside. We have no inside threat now. I know people harp on feeding Moore, but if I’m coaching against us I’d let us do that. As long as he’s not getting lobs, I’ll live with it.

Next year, assuming we get improvement from Sarr, that will change. But even if it doesn’t, teams will have to respect the driving ability of our wings, and that should open things up some outside. Woods is a nasty set shooter, and I think Brown can be too. I expect a very different team next year. And hey, if I’m wrong, I’m on the record that it’s time to go a new direction.
 
tigerswood said:
We all should be excited about the freshmen/incoming freshmen’s potential, but your post above is just based on that, potential. Sarr and Brown haven’t shown they are/can be top-half ACC level starters, and Hoard isn’t a particularly good shooter, which is a pretty key part of the game (I think). It’s wild to think of Moore as our most legit ACC-level player at his position, but he is IMHO.
Click to expand...

Well yeah of course it’s speculation talking about incoming freshman, but it is pretty clear that this year we have three huge issues: 1. PF is a black hole of offense 2. Our guards are bad at defense outside of Chaundee and Chill and 3. Our guards have lost all shot making ability they showed last year and earlier this year.

It’s still speculation, but Hoard playing the 3 automatically makes us much better defensively. Having another 6’8 guy backing him up hells defensively as well. That changes our 1-3 from being 6’3, 6’2, 6’5 to 6’3 6’5 and 6’8. That’s a substantial difference for defensive purposes. Hoard also slashes to the rim a lot and that’s something we haven’t done this year that creates a lot of open shots. Drive and kick is a part of Manning’s offense that our guards haven’t been doing (“get the ball inside whether it’s from the pass or dribble” - Manning says that a lot”). We have the shooters coming back (hopefully) for the drive and kick game to improve our looks.

In Sarr, an off-season under manning and he could be an absolute stud. He has everything you want and actually seems to be able to handle the ball well for a big. He needs to get stronger and not freak out under the basket when he gets the ball. He should start next to Moore next year and we should be one of the biggest teams in the country - which is what I think Manning wants in a basketball team.

Again, it is definitely speculation but at worst we get better size and athleticism at the 3 and that should boost our defense significantly.
 
Clearly Dinos was one of our smartest players, he knew enough to the the money and run.
 
To be clear, I’m not disagreeing that it’s speculation for incoming freshman but Hoard seems to be much further along than Chaundee in HS imo. I don’t know who Chaundee’s school played, but Hoards playing top competition every game. I’m also unsure of his three point shooting ability - I haven’t been able to find stats on it anywhere. I’m expecting a different overall team next year in style of play both on offense and defense.

I agree with Wakelaw on Moore. He’s a great rebounder and does exactly what I wanted him to be able to do this year but our guards have really let us down and we have a huge hole at PF.

Actually agree with Wakelaw on everything he’s said. I’m on record saying he should be gone next year if we aren’t a tournament team as well. We will have the talent to be there (and better than the 10 seed game, too) even if Crawford leaves in my opinion.
 
Chaundee's lack of ball handling ability is just staggering. Just don't know how you're ranked that highly while lacking such a big part of the game as a perimeter player.
 
wakelaw13 said:
I actually think it’s pretty simple. We were a really good shooting team last year because teams had to respect our inside game. Woods and Arians feasted on soft defenses guarding the post and passes inside. We have no inside threat now. I know people harp on feeding Moore, but if I’m coaching against us I’d let us do that. As long as he’s not getting lobs, I’ll live with it.

Next year, assuming we get improvement from Sarr, that will change. But even if it doesn’t, teams will have to respect the driving ability of our wings, and that should open things up some outside. Woods is a nasty set shooter, and I think Brown can be too. I expect a very different team next year. And hey, if I’m wrong, I’m on the record that it’s time to go a new direction.
Click to expand...

While I agree with a lot of what you said, I think you're totally wrong about Moore's post up game. Moore is definitely a threat in the post. He's drawing occasional double teams. Like Collins last year, he needs to learn how to effectively pass out of the double team. He's already shown improvement this year. He makes his hook shot at an impressive rate. He'll never have footwork and moves like Collins with his back to the basket but his length makes him unblockable if gets it in position. He's improved there a lot too since the start of the season. His durability issues are mostly laid to rest. I expect a lot out of him next year and Sarr should step up too.
Our problem will again be TOs, Crawford playing under control, improving our length on defense and getting production on both ends out of the SF position.
Hopefully Manning will get better too. I thought his subs were better today and he did sub out JC after a dumb TO.
 
Brown is just a tremendous defender. I watched him today. Woods plays y league d. Starr thinks he's playing defense because he gets in the neighborhood but he doesn't exert pressure. Mitchell played good d today and just got outmuscled
 
Doggus said:
While I agree with a lot of what you said, I think you're totally wrong about Moore's post up game. Moore is definitely a threat in the post. He's drawing occasional double teams. Like Collins last year, he needs to learn how to effectively pass out of the double team. He's already shown improvement this year. He makes his hook shot at an impressive rate. He'll never have footwork and moves like Collins with his back to the basket but his length makes him unblockable if gets it in position. He's improved there a lot too since the start of the season. His durability issues are mostly laid to rest. I expect a lot out of him next year and Sarr should step up too.
Our problem will again be TOs, Crawford playing under control, improving our length on defense and getting production on both ends out of the SF position.
Hopefully Manning will get better too. I thought his subs were better today and he did sub out JC after a dumb TO.
Click to expand...

I don’t think Moore is bad in the post, I just said I’d live with it. I’d be ok with him taking the hooks and shots away from the rim, if it means preventing Woods and others from taking spot up 3s. That’s the difference I see in our shooting this year.
 
Moore is getting better, when he is in the LOW post he can't be guarded, he needs to relax when he's up there at the rim because no one else is
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top