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F is for Fascism (Ferguson MO)

One would think with all these great leaders and heroes, we could, win a war?
 
WokeandBroke said:
You guess wrong. Leadership certainly starts at home but when your family doesn't provide it people find it in community organizations. Churches, scouting, youth sports, volunteer work.
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He’ll never come out and say it directly but what he really means by this is “government doesn’t solve all of society’s problems, therefore it should not be funded by our tax dollars. We need to take this money and give it back to the taxpayers who will then generously bestow it on charities that will fill all these holes in society and make it better. And this will definitely happen in real life”

It always comes back to lowering taxes on the wealthy. Always.

So at best we get an oligarchy of presumably benevolent overlords. Better hope they’re all in favor of all human rights.

Btw I was in scouts with plenty of degenerates. Better defund that too!
 
birdman said:
Maybe you already know this, but this looks like you are suggesting that we need military style authoritarian leadership in America's cities.

Let's not let that distract from what started as progress towards a discussion. Why does leadership fail in so many urban environments and how to we fix that?
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I'm arguing in favor of emphasizing leadership as a transformative figure in people's lives. As stated, the military might be the easiest example but (as also stated) it is but one of many forms. Athletics, religious organizations, volunteer work and scouting provide mentors every day.

Well-intentioned policies to provide subsistence-based payments have hurt family structure. I know this board loves to hear that, but it is still true.
 
WokeandBroke said:
That one example is, of course. The military base example only shows the value of leadership in the lives of people who don't otherwise have resources. The government doesn't have any monopoly on leadership. It's lazy to say "violent crime is caused by poverty and guns." Bullshit. There a millions of law abiding, armed, poor people. The variable we can change is the presence or absence of leadership.
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Now you gotta go and call me lazy. Cool.

I think that Juice really nailed this a few posts back. Our economy can march along making money for people that already have it just fine without a whole section of society. Leadership has failed in inner cities because there is no money or benefit to leadership to solving poverty and providing economic opportunity. There is only benefit, to leadership, in looking like they care about these things, so that people who sort of care will vote for them to get in or stay in office. Leadership in our democracy is decoupled from the consequences of poverty and violence.
 
WokeandBroke said:
I'm arguing in favor of emphasizing leadership as a transformative figure in people's lives. As stated, the military might be the easiest example but (as also stated) it is but one of many forms. Athletics, religious organizations, volunteer work and scouting provide mentors every day.

Well-intentioned policies to provide subsistence-based payments have hurt family structure. I know this board loves to hear that, but it is still true.
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Best of all they don’t cost taxpayers a dime!

I don’t know how in good faith someone can gloss over all the good things anti poverty programs do to focus on how they “hurt family structure” (wtf). Then hold up all these other organizations as beacons of shining light while glossing over the pretty reprehensible things they do as well.
 
birdman said:
Now you gotta go and call me lazy. Cool.

I think that Juice really nailed this a few posts back. Our economy can march along making money for people that already have it just fine without a whole section of society. Leadership has failed in inner cities because there is no money or benefit to leadership to solving poverty and providing economic opportunity. There is only benefit, to leadership, in looking like they care about these things, so that people who sort of care will vote for them to get in or stay in office. Leadership in our democracy is decoupled from the consequences of poverty and violence.
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I don't think you are lazy. I think that argument is lazy. I think you're a good poster. Poverty is a factor, we agree, but people in impoverished circumstances still have agency.
 
he surfaces like the cicadas and his siren song of "two parent households" seems to drive the citizenry crazy until such time as he wears himself out from all the mental masturbation and trolling and just dies. but his eggs will rise and he'll be back eventually.
 
Shooshmoo said:
And we are back to #bootstraps, ladies and gentlemen. Well done, JH.
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Which of your fellow citizens are you sure are incapable of supporting themselves? Have you informed them of this yet or are you playing that close to the monogrammed vest?
 
WokeandBroke said:
Which of your fellow citizens are you sure are incapable of supporting themselves? Have you informed them of this yet or are you playing that close to the monogrammed vest?
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...he says as he characterizes his fellow citizens as leaderless violent hordes in desperate need of charitable, non taxpayer funded support
 
I like how the military base full of poor people has no crime because of leadership, glossing over no longer needing to worry about food, shelter, utilities, and so forth. Where all those things being essential to reducing levels of crime.
 
Is it worth pointing out that penguins have almost no gun violence in their societies and they have no leadership and no police force?
 
06deacon said:
...he says as he characterizes his fellow citizens as leaderless violent hordes in desperate need of charitable, non taxpayer funded support
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I am arguing that people are not inherently violent, and that their circumstances can be altered by focusing on the things that lift people up: mentorship and opportunity. Investing in their potential and not just their subsistence.

Only in the Tunnels must this position be so disingenuously resisted, because you vainly refuse to admit your well-intended but short-sighted policies aren't working.
 
Woke and broke:
I would suggest that you might gain a deeper understanding and realize that many of your disparaging beliefs are little more than talking points that are not backed up by any degree of validity by reading the book Caste-The Origins of Our Discontent by Isabel Wilkerson.
 
bcobbdeacs said:
Woke and broke:
I would suggest that you might gain a deeper understanding and realize that many of your disparaging beliefs are little more than talking points that are not backed up by any degree of validity by reading the book Caste-The Origins of Our Discontent by Isabel Wilkerson.
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If you find the idea that leadership is pivotal in guiding young people, and its absence is poisonous, to be disparaging, then we shall agree to disagree.
 
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