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OFFICIAL Elizabeth Warren is awesome thread

Wakeforest22890 said:
Yep. Just like you disagree fundamentally with the 14th Amendment but you'll play by the rules since we decided that "whoops maybe the marketplace isn't going to correct itself like we thought it would." Sans 14th Amendment you'd be all for people discriminating left and right against people on the basis of race or otherwise isn't that right?
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Total government overreach.
 
So let's see what we've added to the fundamental right list over the past few years: garbage health insurance, wedding cakes, and equal financial returns. Got it.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Yep. Just like you disagree fundamentally with the 14th Amendment but you'll play by the rules since we decided that "whoops maybe the marketplace isn't going to correct itself like we thought it would." Sans 14th Amendment you'd be all for people discriminating left and right against people on the basis of race or otherwise isn't that right?
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In favor of them discriminating? No. In favor of them having the right to discriminate if they so choose, no matter how bad of an idea that may be? Sure.
 
Yeah must suck to be a white guy who owns his own business these days ya know? Life is rough cuz we're giving all this away to the gays, unwed mothers, dependent welfare queens, and blacks
 
So 2&2 says stupid poors need to gamble more money.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
Sure you do, you know that you could lose everything that you invest. If you didn't already know that, then consider yourself informed. Yet you, along with everyone else, still invest and will continue to invest.
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You are justifying fraud, not investing and possible losses, and you're justifying it by claiming it's a systemic problem so deal with it. I don't equate that to being a Lion with sharper teeth in the wild of Nigeria. Would you do away with listing requirements for national exchanges, or disclosure requirements for a publicly traded company? Why even audit anything if the expectation is that everything they say is BS. Let the buyer beware is one thing, let the buyer be deceived without recourse is different.
 
The whole thing is BS, it is grown-up baseball cards. In the vast majority of cases, there is absolutely no actual correlation between the value of the stock on the market and the actual underlying company, the same way there is no correlation between a piece of cardboard with a player's picture on it and the actual performance of the player. Sure it ebbs and flows as reports come out, but that is just to pimp the image of legitimacy and in reality floats like a fart in the wind. It is a game, a racket, a ruse, a fraud, whatever you want to call it. You could get rid of all securities regulations and we would be in the exact same spot: you are betting on finding the stocks that, for whatever reason, other people like too. Boiling it down, that is all it is.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
The whole thing is BS, it is grown-up baseball cards. In the vast majority of cases, there is absolutely no actual correlation between the value of the stock on the market and the actual underlying company, the same way there is no correlation between a piece of cardboard with a player's picture on it and the actual performance of the player. Sure it ebbs and flows as reports come out, but that is just to pimp the image of legitimacy and in reality floats like a fart in the wind. It is a game, a racket, a ruse, a fraud, whatever you want to call it. You could get rid of all securities regulations and we would be in the exact same spot: you are betting on finding the stocks that, for whatever reason, other people like too. Boiling it down, that is all it is.
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You must be shrooming.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
The whole thing is BS, it is grown-up baseball cards. In the vast majority of cases, there is absolutely no actual correlation between the value of the stock on the market and the actual underlying company, the same way there is no correlation between a piece of cardboard with a player's picture on it and the actual performance of the player. Sure it ebbs and flows as reports come out, but that is just to pimp the image of legitimacy and in reality floats like a fart in the wind. It is a game, a racket, a ruse, a fraud, whatever you want to call it. You could get rid of all securities regulations and we would be in the exact same spot: you are betting on finding the stocks that, for whatever reason, other people like too. Boiling it down, that is all it is.
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thanks to the middlemen on wall street
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
The whole thing is BS, it is grown-up baseball cards. In the vast majority of cases, there is absolutely no actual correlation between the value of the stock on the market and the actual underlying company, the same way there is no correlation between a piece of cardboard with a player's picture on it and the actual performance of the player. Sure it ebbs and flows as reports come out, but that is just to pimp the image of legitimacy and in reality floats like a fart in the wind. It is a game, a racket, a ruse, a fraud, whatever you want to call it. You could get rid of all securities regulations and we would be in the exact same spot: you are betting on finding the stocks that, for whatever reason, other people like too. Boiling it down, that is all it is.
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I like this analogy to the extent that anything is only worth what you can sell it for, but securities regulations, accounting requirements, national exchanges, and disclosure laws combine to imply a sense of trust in investing. When an accounting firm audits and confirms a companies' books as legit, I'm making decisions based on that knowledge. If an auction house verifies that a Honus Wagner card is legit, I'm making a decision based on that knowledge. If I get it home and the picture falls off and it's a Chuck Knoblauck card, I'm not very happy.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
The whole thing is BS, it is grown-up baseball cards. In the vast majority of cases, there is absolutely no actual correlation between the value of the stock on the market and the actual underlying company, the same way there is no correlation between a piece of cardboard with a player's picture on it and the actual performance of the player. Sure it ebbs and flows as reports come out, but that is just to pimp the image of legitimacy and in reality floats like a fart in the wind. It is a game, a racket, a ruse, a fraud, whatever you want to call it. You could get rid of all securities regulations and we would be in the exact same spot: you are betting on finding the stocks that, for whatever reason, other people like too. Boiling it down, that is all it is.
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Valuing a company based on fundamental analysis of a company's free cash flow times a multiple based on growth expectations then subtracting the value of debt obligations to reach a value to which equity holders have a right seems pretty far from putting everything on red on a roulette wheel or a players batting average as correlated to his trading card value.

One of us is an idiot, I'm just not willing to take a hard stand on which.
 
bullets said:
Valuing a company based on fundamental analysis of a company's free cash flow times a multiple based on growth expectations then subtracting the value of debt obligations to reach a value to which equity holders have a right seems pretty far from putting everything on red on a roulette wheel or a players batting average as correlated to his trading card value.

One of us is an idiot, I'm just not willing to take a hard stand on which.
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LOL
 
ImTheCaptain said:
thanks to the middlemen on wall street
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No, thanks to the demand of the population. How many people do you know who only want to buy stocks whose value remains absolutely constant and whose only potential income is dividends? Because that is the limit of where we would be without the market price disconnect from the company.
 
bullets said:
Valuing a company based on fundamental analysis of a company's free cash flow times a multiple based on growth expectations then subtracting the value of debt obligations to reach a value to which equity holders have a right seems pretty far from putting everything on red on a roulette wheel or a players batting average as correlated to his trading card value.

One of us is an idiot, I'm just not willing to take a hard stand on which.
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But that valuation is absolutely meaningless if the investing public decides that it likes the company's logo so therefore is going to start buying it and drive the price up. At the end of the day, it is a piece of paper, and not even that nowadays, it is an electronic blip. All of those valuation methods are just ways to chase after the actual price and try to keep the trailing gap close.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
No, thanks to the demand of the population. How many people do you know who only want to buy stocks whose value remains absolutely constant and whose only potential income is dividends? Because that is the limit of where we would be without the market price disconnect from the company.
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fundamental misunderstanding of equity markets for $200, alex
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
But that valuation is absolutely meaningless if the investing public decides that it likes the company's logo so therefore is going to start buying it and drive the price up. At the end of the day, it is a piece of paper, and not even that nowadays, it is an electronic blip. All of those valuation methods are just ways to chase after the actual price and try to keep the trailing gap close.
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markets definitely experience bubbles but the name of the game is valuing future cash flows. Random people who "like a company's logo" aren't even a drop in the ocean when accounting for money management firms, institutions, and pensions.

Again I may be a total idiot but I don't think apple's equity is valued at $700billion because people like the logo.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
Sure you do, you know that you could lose everything that you invest. If you didn't already know that, then consider yourself informed. Yet you, along with everyone else, still invest and will continue to invest.
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That is theft. They are stealing money. You say you are for property rights. If they lie and steal my property, you should be against that.
 
How is it stealing if I give it to them with the express knowledge that they might lose it all? They didn't come and take it from me without my consent.
 
2&2 Slider To Leyritz said:
How is it stealing if I give it to them with the express knowledge that they might lose it all? They didn't come and take it from me without my consent.
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Because they took your money after giving you bullshit information to get said money.


Like, what GNC was just fined for. They told the public that their supplement water et al was going to help them be healthier and get all the nutrients they need. However, they didn't actually put any vitamins or minerals in their products so the consumers of those products didn't get what was promised to them.
 
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