Season long PGA tour thread--the presidents cup from south korea

[Shorty]

It's not the long putter itself that is banned. It's the technique of anchoring it to your body at a fixed point. The governing bodies felt that the resulting usage of the putter was not an actual "stroke" in the classic sense.

I agree with the anchoring ban at the elite level, but I think it should have been done 20 years ago. I don't agree with the ban as they chose to do it where it covered all golfers. The last thing golf needs at a time when participation numbers are dwindling is another stuffy rule that may make the game harder for some of the higher handicappers who play it for recreation.

If the governing bodies really wanted to go after something that is an affront to the tradition of the game, they should start and end their search with the golf ball.

You're absolutely right about the ball. Back in October, I had a chance to play the course I grew up playing with my Dad for the first time in 25 years. There is one par five on the course with a creek that crosses the fairway about 50 yards from the green. Playing it as a twenty something, I would always would hit driver, five wood to get to my wedge. Last fall I hit driver, seven iron to get to the same spot.

 

[Liquid Karma]

Interesting. Thanks for the explanation. What's wrong with the golf ball?

Simply put, the ball flies way too far for elite level players. This has led to courses being lengthened, which costs money and combined with the subsequent increase in maintenance costs leads to increased costs for the average golfer.

On top of that, longer and harder courses take more time to play, which is a huge barrier for getting people interested in golf.

The bottom line is that three of the barriers for entry into the game (cost, time, difficulty) are directly affected by the dramatic increase in distance the ball flies starting in 2001 (the introduction of the Titleist ProV1).

The game desperately needs rules bifurcation: one set of rules for elite amateurs and professionals, and another set of rules for the other 99% of golfers. The elite players should be playing a dialed back ball in competition, and the rest of the golfers out there should have a MUCH more relaxed set of rules to adhere to.

 

[cville deac]

Not a huge Patrick Reed fan, but he has as more wins at his age than almost any other PGA Tour golfer except Tiger (forgot the exact stat) after winning last week, and he seems very mentally tough.

I'm a bigger fan of Justine's. But I kinda like Fatrick as well. He's blunt and brash but otherwise doesn't seem like a bad guy. And he was great at the RC, so there's that. I also like Jimmy Walker and think he'll have a good year even though his short game faltered late on Sunday last week.

 

[Teamramrod]

I'm a big fan of Reed after last year's Ryder Cup.

He's an asshole, but he's OUR asshole! U-S-A U-S-A U-S-A

 

[simosfrostyone]

Next time you play an upscale course or any course where pro or high level am events are played check out the distance between the tips and the member tees (if you can see that far). That will tell you all you need to know.

 

[Liquid Karma]

You're absolutely right about the ball. Back in October, I had a chance to play the course I grew up playing with my Dad for the first time in 25 years. There is one par five on the course with a creek that crosses the fairway about 50 yards from the green. Playing it as a twenty something, I would always would hit driver, five wood to get to my wedge. Last fall I hit driver, seven iron to get to the same spot.

Same thing happened to me. Growing up in Tucson there was a 575 yard par 5 on my home course that was always a driver, 3w, wedge. Went back a few years ago and hit driver, 4 iron onto the green.

Example #2 - I played a USGA qualifier at Pinebrook in Winston Salem back in 1999. On the 9th hole (roughly 400 yard dogleg right with fairway bunkers on the inside corner that require a 250 yard carry), the entire field (myself included) was hitting driver out left of the bunkers which would leave them 150-160 yards into the green. Once the new balls came out, I just blow it over the bunkers and have a 60-80 yard wedge shot into the green. Last year the hole was lengthened to 450 yards with a new back tee, and I have still seen 3 people take it over those same bunkers on the fly.

 

[Liquid Karma]

Next time you play an upscale course or any course where pro or high level am events are played check out the distance between the tips and the member tees (if you can see that far). That will tell you all you need to know.

Go play the Ocean Course at Kiawah. The 7600+ tees used for the PGA 3 years ago are miles behind the 7000 tees that were used for the Carolinas Am a couple years ago.

 

[Teamramrod]

Simply put, the ball flies way too far for elite level players. This has led to courses being lengthened, which costs money and combined with the subsequent increase in maintenance costs leads to increased costs for the average golfer.

On top of that, longer and harder courses take more time to play, which is a huge barrier for getting people interested in golf.

The bottom line is that three of the barriers for entry into the game (cost, time, difficulty) are directly affected by the dramatic increase in distance the ball flies starting in 2001 (the introduction of the Titleist ProV1).

The game desperately needs rules bifurcation: one set of rules for elite amateurs and professionals, and another set of rules for the other 99% of golfers. The elite players should be playing a dialed back ball in competition, and the rest of the golfers out there should have a MUCH more relaxed set of rules to adhere to.

I hate it, but that does need to be a thing.

The problem I see with that, is people are always going to try to play like the pros no matter how many "Play it forward" or "Speed up" campaigns there are because they want to go try to be Tiger, Rory, Bubba, etc...

 

[Liquid Karma]

I hate it, but that does need to be a thing.

The problem I see with that, is people are always going to try to play like the pros no matter how many "Play it forward" or "Speed up" campaigns there are because they want to go try to be Tiger, Rory, Bubba, etc...

True, and I have yet to read any reasonable solution to that problem.

 

[simosfrostyone]

Go play the Ocean Course at Kiawah. The 7600+ tees used for the PGA 3 years ago are miles behind the 7000 tees that were used for the Carolinas Am a couple years ago.

No thanks. That is my least favorite course on the island.

 

[Liquid Karma]

No thanks. That is my least favorite course on the island.

Cassique is much more fun to play. The River is too, but I still love the setting of the Ocean Course and I have fond memories of one of the best rounds of my life out there a few years ago.

 

[mebanedeac]

I wonder if part of the solution might be that instead of lengthening courses the fairways might be narrowed and the rough lengthened whereby accuracy would become more important than length...at least on most of the par 4s. A 300 yd. drive that goes 30 yards off the fairway ceases to be an advantage.

In other words, increase the value of shot-making.

 

[Teamramrod]

I wonder if part of the solution might be that instead of lengthening courses the fairways might be narrowed and the rough lengthened whereby accuracy would become more important than length...at least on most of the par 4s. A 300 yd. drive that goes 30 yards off the fairway ceases to be an advantage.

In other words, increase the value of shot-making.

That will slow play down even more because people will sit there and look for their balls forever, chunk shots out of longer rough, and so on.

 

[Teamramrod]

True, and I have yet to read any reasonable solution to that problem.

There's always a wall of shame for slow play...

 

[RacerDeac]

Same thing happened to me. Growing up in Tucson there was a 575 yard par 5 on my home course that was always a driver, 3w, wedge. Went back a few years ago and hit driver, 4 iron onto the green.

For me, it's #1 & 3 at OTC. I would play 1-3 over and over as a kid, so those three holes are really ingrained in my mind.

Playing high school golf, we always hit driver on #1 and were short of the creek. I went back to play a few years after college from the whites, not even thinking about it, and found my ball on the other side of the creek. Then, on #3, the goal in high school was always to put the ball over the right-hand bunkers and get some roll as it kicked off the back side of the hill. That same shot after college put my ball up within chipping distance of the green. The same story continues around the course...the 300-350 yard Par 4's that were once relatively difficult due to the bunkers and tiny greens were simple now that you had a sand wedge or less into every green. And then #17, which always seemed like the longest Par 5 growing up suddenly became a legitimate eagle opportunity.

 

[TownieDeac]

Simply put, the ball flies way too far for elite level players. This has led to courses being lengthened, which costs money and combined with the subsequent increase in maintenance costs leads to increased costs for the average golfer.

On top of that, longer and harder courses take more time to play, which is a huge barrier for getting people interested in golf.

The bottom line is that three of the barriers for entry into the game (cost, time, difficulty) are directly affected by the dramatic increase in distance the ball flies starting in 2001 (the introduction of the Titleist ProV1).

The game desperately needs rules bifurcation: one set of rules for elite amateurs and professionals, and another set of rules for the other 99% of golfers. The elite players should be playing a dialed back ball in competition, and the rest of the golfers out there should have a MUCH more relaxed set of rules to adhere to.

Next time you play an upscale course or any course where pro or high level am events are played check out the distance between the tips and the member tees (if you can see that far). That will tell you all you need to know.

Go play the Ocean Course at Kiawah. The 7600+ tees used for the PGA 3 years ago are miles behind the 7000 tees that were used for the Carolinas Am a couple years ago.

For a noob (15 handicapper) like me who plays maybe 3 or 4 times a year with 20+ year old clubs I am familiar with exactly none of this.

 

[mebanedeac]

For a noob (15 handicapper) like me who plays maybe 3 or 4 times a year with 20+ year old clubs I am familiar with exactly none of this.

You have just described 80-90% of those who attempt to play this game.

 

[Wakeforest22890]

Racer how far do you hit the ball? From the sounds of it you're driving it around 325-350.

 

[Liquid Karma]

Racer how far do you hit the ball? From the sounds of it you're driving it around 325-350.

He's not playing the tips if he hit it within chipping distance on #3.

 

[bmoneydeac]

Is there any chance Townie's 15 handicap isn't just another #townielie?