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So how exactly did this happen?

Jesus Christ, that well is dry. You want to take a gamble at what percentage of Americans are employed in the automotive manufacturing industry?

Just as I said, you have ZERO ideas for helping the working poor that don't involve lower corporate tax and regulation.
 
Because people realize that they don't, in fact, assist in the working class in the long run. How many closed factories in the rust belt do we need as evidence that Dem's well-intended, short-term thinking doesn't actually work. I'll agree to "try", but the facts have a problem when it comes to "do."

When Dems rush out laughable, unsustainable, naive things like a $15.00 minimum wage, you can actually measure their failures to help working class people by the innovation their policies trigger in automation. In the race to help working poor, many Dem policies win the proverbial popular vote.

you know, i agree 100%. DEMs are short sided in some of their policies, but someone has to try to help ours (no matter how you look at it, the worst American is still an American human).

Unfortunately, I just don't understand people that don't get this, closing factories are due to increase profits by to automation or moving overseas (same task is done cheaper and better). that is what this country is build on...capitalism! it is not going to change no matter what Trump does, or what factory jobs he promised to return to the rubes. nobody wants to bring America back to the 70s. It makes no sense...that time is over and gone!

now, what do we do with those people?
 
you know, i agree 100%. DEMs are short sided in some of their policies, but someone has to try to help ours (no matter how you look at it, the worst American is still an American human).

Unfortunately, I just don't understand people that don't get this, closing factories are due to increase profits by to automation or moving overseas (same task is done cheaper and better). that is what this country is build on...capitalism! it is not going to change no matter what Trump does, or what factory jobs he promised to return to the rubes. nobody wants to bring America back to the 70s. It makes no sense...that time is over and gone!

now, what do we do with those people?

His answer would be restore the market's minimum wage by enforcing our borders. It will cause consumer prices to rise, corporations will hate it, but it's the true cost of goods sold (as opposed to undercutting reality and pushing families onto the taxpayer).

You can make stuff in this country. You can't make everything in this country, but (since MDMH doesn't want to talk about cars because, well, his theories don't work well in that example), look at beer. The "cheapest" beer is made in mass produced, hyper-efficient canned bottling plants cranking out light American lager. The cheapest food is made the same way. Consumers---dare I say some on these hallowed pages---don't always choose the lowest bidder on stuff. Well-made, craft products will always have a place in a marketplace full of insufferable snobs like some of the people that post here consumers with refined tastes.

People pay more for products labeled environmentally friendly (curiously, whether or not the product is net-net safer for the environment). We could have the same consciousness about where a product is made. It's just been easier, and certainly more easily digestible politically, to cut bait, surrender and ask the taxpayer to provide. Shouldn't we at least try before tendering our surrender?
 
His answer would be restore the market's minimum wage by enforcing our borders. It will cause consumer prices to rise, corporations will hate it, but it's the true cost of goods sold (as opposed to undercutting reality and pushing families onto the taxpayer).

You can make stuff in this country. You can't make everything in this country, but (since MDMH doesn't want to talk about cars because, well, his theories don't work well in that example), look at beer. The "cheapest" beer is made in mass produced, hyper-efficient canned bottling plants cranking out light American lager. The cheapest food is made the same way. Consumers---dare I say some on these hallowed pages---don't always choose the lowest bidder on stuff. Well-made, craft products will always have a place in a marketplace full of insufferable snobs like some of the people that post here consumers with refined tastes.

People pay more for products labeled environmentally friendly (curiously, whether or not the product is net-net safer for the environment). We could have the same consciousness about where a product is made. It's just been easier, and certainly more easily digestible politically, to cut bait, surrender and ask the taxpayer to provide. Shouldn't we at least try before tendering our surrender?

Liberals pay more for products that are environmentally friendly. Companies have used "Made in the USA" as a marketing brand for most of my lifetime. Doesn't seem to be something that the market values.
 
My "theories"? There is no theory needed - flailing car manufacturers will move production to other states with lower infrastructure costs, states that don't allow labor bargaining rights. We call that a race to the bottom. I'll be sure to learn my lesson and not build another city around a manufacturing industry.
 
Liberals pay more for products that they think are environmentally friendly. Companies have used "Made in the USA" as a marketing brand for most of my lifetime. Doesn't seem to be something that the market values.

We could, as a culture, place the same priority we do on perceived environmental friendliness on sourcing. For years, the "Union label" meant something. I am not saying that it is easy, push-button solution, but it's something we could choose to prioritize. We didn't always care about the environment, but when people's eyes were opened to the "true costs", they made more conscious choices.
 
My "theories"? There is no theory needed - flailing car manufacturers will move production to other states with lower infrastructure costs, states that don't allow labor bargaining rights. We call that a race to the bottom. I'll be sure to learn my lesson and not build another city around a manufacturing industry.

I can't remember the last time I spent much time worrying whether you'll actually learn a lesson from full-on failure. You're already so gosh-darn smart and empathetic, there's none left for anyone else!
 
I can't remember the last time I spent much time worrying whether you'll actually learn a lesson from full-on failure. You're already so gosh-darn smart and empathetic, there's none left for anyone else!
My intelligence and empathy is irrelevant to you talking about your own ideas. I challenged you to provide any idea as to how the government could help the working poor that didn't involve unburdening corporations. It's a very simple question. Why don't you stop talking about me, and Detroit, and just answer it?
 
His answer would be restore the market's minimum wage by enforcing our borders. It will cause consumer prices to rise, corporations will hate it, but it's the true cost of goods sold (as opposed to undercutting reality and pushing families onto the taxpayer).

You can make stuff in this country. You can't make everything in this country, but (since MDMH doesn't want to talk about cars because, well, his theories don't work well in that example), look at beer. The "cheapest" beer is made in mass produced, hyper-efficient canned bottling plants cranking out light American lager. The cheapest food is made the same way. Consumers---dare I say some on these hallowed pages---don't always choose the lowest bidder on stuff. Well-made, craft products will always have a place in a marketplace full of insufferable snobs like some of the people that post here consumers with refined tastes.

People pay more for products labeled environmentally friendly (curiously, whether or not the product is net-net safer for the environment). We could have the same consciousness about where a product is made. It's just been easier, and certainly more easily digestible politically, to cut bait, surrender and ask the taxpayer to provide. Shouldn't we at least try before tendering our surrender?

they have been pushing the "Made in America" trend for a while but Walmart is still the #1 store in America, and none of their crap comes from the good ole USA. that is ten fold when you talk about rural America. anything "environmentally friendly", "micro-brewed" or "organic" they will not buy that hippie overpriced shit...it is more of a liberal DEM tax (that is a joke). besides, most of our "light American Lagers" are no longer American owned...:rulz:
 
A closed factory in Michigan isn't a theory to the people who lost their jobs, champ. The paychecks written at new plants in the South aren't fictional either. Congrats again on the popular vote.

I read a post by a black guy in Detroit about how excited people in his community are at the news. It's a nice start. Bill Clinton said we need to bring in more refugees from Syria and we can use them to rebuild Detroit. To me, that's a profoundly out of touch comment. Instead of bringing in foreigners to rebuild Detroit, why not give those jobs to the people who are already there. Anyway, Trump implementing an immigration policy that works for the American people instead of hurting them is something that would benefit the native born working class who are competing with immigrants. It sucks for the low skilled labor from other countries. Also, Trump encouraging companies to remain/come back might help. He has a different philosophy when it comes to trade than pretty much every other president I can recall.
 
Both parties are full of fail. The Dems for not changing the way they think and continuing to push failed policies like increased safety net with no way to get out but they get an A for effort and at least trying. Republicans for not ever addressing the issue and for tap dancing around it with the shiny distraction of lower taxes for people that don't make any money already, but they get an A for deflection and avoidance.

The answer in a global economy is providing a way for American workers to become more than just a body. That requires specified training and education that those they are competing against don't have access to. This means robotics, clean energy, science, trade crafts etc... however politicians have no reason to go this way because voters vote for them anyway. The desperation of these voters can be seen in their election of Trump, they think at least it's something different just maybe something will change. Nothing will, or it will be delaying the inevitable but at least it's not the Pub/Dem tag team of fail.
 
they have been pushing the "Made in America" trend for a while but Walmart is still the #1 store in America, and none of their crap comes from the good ole USA. that is ten fold when you talk about rural America. anything "environmentally friendly", "micro-brewed" or "organic" they will not buy that hippie overpriced shit...it is more of a liberal DEM tax (that is a joke). besides, most of our "light American Lagers" are no longer American owned...:rulz:

They don't to buy a Ford Fusion to sell you one.
 
Both parties are full of fail. The Dems for not changing the way they think and continuing to push failed policies like increased safety net with no way to get out but they get an A for effort and at least trying. Republicans for not ever addressing the issue and for tap dancing around it with the shiny distraction of lower taxes for people that don't make any money already, but they get an A for deflection and avoidance.

The answer in a global economy is providing a way for American workers to become more than just a body. That requires specified training and education that those they are competing against don't have access to. This means robotics, clean energy, science, trade crafts etc... however politicians have no reason to go this way because voters vote for them anyway. The desperation of these voters can be seen in their election of Trump, they think at least it's something different just maybe something will change. Nothing will, or it will be delaying the inevitable but at least it's not the Pub/Dem tag team of fail.

ThinkingWithMyDeac gets an A for this post.
 
Both parties are full of fail. The Dems for not changing the way they think and continuing to push failed policies like increased safety net with no way to get out but they get an A for effort and at least trying. Republicans for not ever addressing the issue and for tap dancing around it with the shiny distraction of lower taxes for people that don't make any money already, but they get an A for deflection and avoidance.

The answer in a global economy is providing a way for American workers to become more than just a body. That requires specified training and education that those they are competing against don't have access to. This means robotics, clean energy, science, trade crafts etc... however politicians have no reason to go this way because voters vote for them anyway. The desperation of these voters can be seen in their election of Trump, they think at least it's something different just maybe something will change. Nothing will, or it will be delaying the inevitable but at least it's not the Pub/Dem tag team of fail.

 
Trump implementing an immigration policy that works for the American people instead of hurting them is something that would benefit the native born working class who are competing with immigrants. It sucks for the low skilled labor from other countries.

Rounding up and deporting the amount of immigrants Trump has proposed will cost billions and will very likely be disastrous for the small business economy. You seem to have this weirdly naive belief that this is a plug and play situation where millions of illegal immigrants are pulled out of jobs and legal citizens are immediately plugged right in 1/1.
 
Rounding up and deporting the amount of immigrants Trump has proposed will cost billions and will very likely be disastrous for the small business economy. You seem to have this weirdly naive belief that this is a plug and play situation where millions of illegal immigrants are pulled out of jobs and legal citizens are immediately plugged right in 1/1.

Yep. He seems to believe that legal citizens are just as skilled and willing to do those jobs.
 
Yep. He seems to believe that legal citizens are just as skilled and willing to do those jobs.

didn't we learn this lesson under Bush? some jobs here American Americans just don't want to do, despite being unemployed.
 
Yep. He seems to believe that legal citizens are just as skilled and willing to do those jobs.
The law is the law. But the law is selectively enforced everyday. Police can't stop every speeder and ticket every jay walker. Immigration law isn't foolproof and we knowingly enforce it selectively, because of the benefit/cost/risk ratio. We've got millions of businesses that employ illegal immigrants, and very very many of those jobs and businesses will disappear if those illegals are deported. That will remove a lot of taxable income and sales tax from the economy. On top of that, it will cost billions to deport those immigrants and keep them out. Now what we are left with is hoping that legal citizens are capable of filling those remaining unfilled jobs. It's very very doubtful the economic benefits will outweigh the costs.
 
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