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So You Are George Zimmerman, What Do You Do Now?

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PhDeac said:
I should get paid as Senior Minority Correspondent like on the Daily Show.

My thought is that there just isn't much pan-Hispanic identification. A Mexican in Texas or a Dominican in NYC probably doesn't have much shared experience with a half Peruvian guy in Orlando. I don't even know if Zimmerman speaks Spanish or identifies as Hispanic. I don't remember if he appealed to Latinos in his community or nationally.

I'm sure he can find more nuanced perspectives online. Bash away.
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Wrangor said:
U seem to be the only one bashing. I was actually interested in your opinion. Not sure what I wrote that set you off. I sometimes have this crazy notion that people one these boards want to discuss an issue rather than yell at each other.
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Wrangor, it seems like you want to play the victim here regardless. I suggested ways you can find more informed perspectives than my own. Then when I actually gave you my opinion, you get defensive.
 
Wrangor said:
Does this incident drive a wedge between the Latino and African American blocks....ie possibly leave room for conservatives to make gains with more conservative Latinos?
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If the Latino community is paying attention, they've heard the cries from Palin, Steve King, and Bill Kristol that the GOP lost in 2012, not because of the Latino vote but because not enough White conservatives turned out. They've also heard that Reagan's 1986 immigration act screwed the GOP because Latinos became Dems disproportionately. The patron saint of the current far right isn't Reagan, it's Pat Buchanan and many conservatives aren't at all afraid to lash out at Latinos to pump up the cranky, elderly White vote. Don't think Zimmerman's ethnic background changes that dynamic one bit.
 
And White conservatives were the ones to rally around Zimmerman, not Latinos.
 
PhDeac said:
Wrangor, it seems like you want to play the victim here regardless. I suggested ways you can find more informed perspectives than my own. Then when I actually gave you my opinion, you get defensive.
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You gave your thoughts after being a smart aleck about My question. I was responding to BBD on my post after yours at that point. It's cool. Defensive or whatever you want to call it. I asked a question and you responded how you did. Not worried about it.

I can't help but notice people calling Zimmerman half Peruvian as if he isn't Latino. Would make Saneff proud.
 
FuckmouthedRube said:
If the Latino community is paying attention, they've heard the cries from Palin, Steve King, and Bill Kristol that the GOP lost in 2012, not because of the Latino vote but because not enough White conservatives turned out. They've also heard that Reagan's 1986 immigration act screwed the GOP because Latinos became Dems disproportionately. The patron saint of the current far right isn't Reagan, it's Pat Buchanan and many conservatives aren't at all afraid to lash out at Latinos to pump up the cranky, elderly White vote. Don't think Zimmerman's ethnic background changes that dynamic one bit.
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Agree but there is certainly a portion of the conservative voting bloc that is much more sympathetic to Immigration and while that is certainly not the cranky white guy I think it is very likely that we are beginning to see a changing of the guard in the pub party. More towards Christie and Rubio and away from cranky white guys. At least that is my hope.

I guess my original question stemmed from this thought.

How would the black community have responded if Democrats came out in mass against Rodney King and republicans had his back in the
Media. I know that would never happened. But I have to imagine that the voting dynamics would have changed.

This not identical by any means but it is a racially charged event in which the parties are split. One side is supporting TM and the other is supporting Zimmerman. If we have any Latino members of this board I would love heir thoughts. My neighbors are Latino but to be honest I have only known them a short period of time and wouldn't feel comfortable asking in case there are some pretty charged emotions about the scenario.

I agree that Republican policy has done whatever it can to have away the Latino vote. In my opinion that is a shame as Fromm perspective Latinos seem to be very religious/conservative/family oriented by nature and as a voting bloc seem to be a natural fit for the Republican Party if we would just get out of our own way and stop forcing them to vote democrat with terrible
Immigration policy.
 
bigdoublezero said:
Someone on this thread is definitely making Saneff proud.
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Please enlighten me. Considering it is clear that is pointed towards me.

I'm a racist because I think that a political group ganging up against a member of a minority group
Might have an impact at the voting booth?

Sure buddy.
 
Wrangor said:
Please enlighten me. Considering it is clear that is pointed towards me.

I'm a racist because I think that a political group ganging up against a member of a minority group
Might have an impact at the voting booth?

Sure buddy.
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I'm not saying you're racist. Just willfully clueless about racial issues.
 
Wrangor said:
Agree but there is certainly a portion of the conservative voting bloc that is much more sympathetic to Immigration and while that is certainly not the cranky white guy I think it is very likely that we are beginning to see a changing of the guard in the pub party. More towards Christie and Rubio and away from cranky white guys. At least that is my hope.

I agree that Republican policy has done whatever it can to have away the Latino vote. In my opinion that is a shame as Fromm perspective Latinos seem to be very religious/conservative/family oriented by nature and as a voting bloc seem to be a natural fit for the Republican Party if we would just get out of our own way and stop forcing them to vote democrat with terrible Immigration policy.
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That's my hope too, but the data doesn't support that in any way, shape, or form. 14 of 46 GOP Senators (30%) voted for immigration reform. Boehner's the highest ranking 'Pub in DC and he says the House wants no part of the Senate bill. 70% opposition is a floor not a ceiling for House opposition to immigration reform. Palin and Coulter despise Rubio and Christie and "true" conservatives (i.e the people who vote in GOP primaries) want no part of them as part of the GOP 2016 ticket. Like it or not, the cranky White nativists are winning the debate within the GOP and frankly it's not even remotely close.
 
bigdoublezero said:
I'm not saying you're racist. Just willfully clueless about racial issues.
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It is very clear that African Americans have pretty much universally identified with TM. Are you saying that Latino's haven't done the same thing with GZ? That they are ambivalent towards GZ's race? I am trying to figure out what you are getting at, and what I am so clueless about. I think at some level Latino's identify more with GZ then they do TM. Are you saying otherwise?

I think that identification (level of identification obviously varies) could potentially impact the political landscape (nothing major, but possibly create some dissatisfaction with the Democrats that are lambasting one of their own). This is clueless? It seems pretty foolish to me that you would suggest there is no identification among Latino's. Are you suggesting because he is a mix race that he doesn't count?
 
FuckmouthedRube said:
That's my hope too, but the data doesn't support that in any way, shape, or form. 14 of 46 GOP Senators (30%) voted for immigration reform. Boehner's the highest ranking 'Pub in DC and he says the House wants no part of the Senate bill. 70% opposition is a floor not a ceiling for House opposition to immigration reform. Palin and Coulter despise Rubio and Christie and "true" conservatives (i.e the people who vote in GOP primaries) want no part of them as part of the GOP 2016 ticket. Like it or not, the cranky White nativists are winning the debate within the GOP and frankly it's not even remotely close.
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Agree and I am not sure how that changes. Immigration really is the single issue that could level the playing field. A 50/50 split in the Latino vote really changes everything.
 
Wrangor said:
It is very clear that African Americans have pretty much universally identified with TM. Are you saying that Latino's haven't done the same thing with GZ? That they are ambivalent towards GZ's race? I am trying to figure out what you are getting at, and what I am so clueless about. I think at some level Latino's identify more with GZ then they do TM. Are you saying otherwise?

I think that identification (level of identification obviously varies) could potentially impact the political landscape (nothing major, but possibly create some dissatisfaction with the Democrats that are lambasting one of their own). This is clueless? It seems pretty foolish to me that you would suggest there is no identification among Latino's. Are you suggesting because he is a mix race that he doesn't count?
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Obama says hi on the mix race issue.

If Zimmerman's name was more Latino, I think it would be more identifiable for Latinos. Right or wrong, if his name is Jorge Espinoza rather than George Zimmerman, it's much easier to disregard his race.
 
"I think at some level Latino's identify more with GZ then they do TM. Are you saying otherwise?"

I would absolutely say otherwise. Latinos are used to being victimized like Trayvon was rather than being the ones that get the benefit of the doubt in the judicial system.

I can't see how you feel Latinos think they get a fair shake.
 
Wrangor, just find some links about Latinos rallying behind Zimmerman and post them. There's a lot of information out there beyond this board.
 
Wrangor said:
It is very clear that African Americans have pretty much universally identified with TM. Are you saying that Latino's haven't done the same thing with GZ? That they are ambivalent towards GZ's race? I am trying to figure out what you are getting at, and what I am so clueless about. I think at some level Latino's identify more with GZ then they do TM. Are you saying otherwise?

I think that identification (level of identification obviously varies) could potentially impact the political landscape (nothing major, but possibly create some dissatisfaction with the Democrats that are lambasting one of their own). This is clueless? It seems pretty foolish to me that you would suggest there is no identification among Latino's. Are you suggesting because he is a mix race that he doesn't count?
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Even if Latinos rallied behind Zimmerman, which they do not, what's the next step in the flow chart getting to GOP making inroads with Hispanics because of the Trayvon Martin slaying?

It's a fucking stupid premise that leads nowhere. That's the point. Only someone with a shallow understanding of race in America would ask a question like that and expect a rational response.
 
ONW said:
Obama says hi on the mix race issue.

If Zimmerman's name was more Latino, I think it would be more identifiable for Latinos. Right or wrong, if his name is Jorge Espinoza rather than George Zimmerman, it's much easier to disregard his race.
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That was kind of my point with the Saneff comment. I keep hearing half Peruvian instead of just Latino. We don't call Obama half Kenyan. Your point about names is salient. If Barack Obamas name was Henry Stevens he would be viewed differently (for better or for worse).

Anyway. Clearly no one is reallu interested in discussing this. Ill shove off. Still can't figure out why the backlash was so huge on what I thought was a fairly innocent question. Cheers.
 
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