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The New Socialists

Louis Gossett Jr said:
Yeah but people are willing to add to congestion for the freedom to go where they want when they want to.
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And 2nd amendment advocates are willing to add to the school shooting death rate to maintain their access to firearms.
 
The broader argument is not that we have Trump because people in the 2016 election didn't listen to "experts," it's that we have Trump because the widely accepted faith in technocratic liberalism failed to provide any long term effective policy against corporate power and oligarchy. We don't have traffic problems because science hasn't figured it out. We have traffic problems because our communities were designed to make money for capitalists, not to ease the burden of traveling from point A to point B.

We don't have healthcare problems because we don't know the best ways to deliver care to people. We have healthcare problems precisely because the concentration of power is with the technocratic elite.
 
I'm kinda surprised that those who decry corporate capitalism and income disparity support two companies who are among the biggest examples of that issue in Uber and Lyft. Drivers make a subsistence living versus investors and senior management cashing in outrageous amounts.
 
RJKarl said:
I'm kinda surprised that those who decry corporate capitalism and income disparity support two companies who are among the biggest examples of that issue in Uber and Lyft. Drivers make a subsistence living versus investors and senior management cashing in outrageous amounts.
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People who put in the risk, capital, thought power, and initiative to invent/start Uber and Lyft cashing in yuge, while millions have been able to make a subsistence living from leveraging the innovation is a GOOD thing though.
 
WFcatamount22 said:
People who put in the risk, capital, thought power, and initiative to invent/start Uber and Lyft cashing in yuge, while millions have been able to make a subsistence living from leveraging the innovation is a GOOD thing though.
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good for whom? certainly not for the society that now deals with even more traffic congestion and more people barely making subsistence-level wages...
 
WFcatamount22 said:
People who put in the risk, capital, thought power, and initiative to invent/start Uber and Lyft cashing in yuge, while millions have been able to make a subsistence living from leveraging the innovation is a GOOD thing though.
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That makes no sense. If there is that much money to be made, the workers should make more.
 
MHBDemon said:
Im not necessarily disagreeing with you, but isn’t this too close to rule by technocracy? Can’t we empower working class people to be democratic and provide solutions that aren’t funded by a fucking think tank?

That isn’t to say we don’t need accountants or lawyers or other skills, but smart educated people have been fucking everything up. I don’t want to be governed by a bunch of Harvard assholes.
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Strickland33 said:
good for whom? certainly not for the society that now deals with even more traffic congestion and more people barely making subsistence-level wages...
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auto mechanics, road maintenance contractors, service station owners, vehicle and parts manufactures, medical providers, etc.
 
RJKarl said:
That makes no sense. If there is that much money to be made, the workers should make more.
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Technically right now actually Uber and Lift cant even afford their own cost model, and are losing money hand over fist.
 
Strickland33 said:
good for whom? certainly not for the society that now deals with even more traffic congestion and more people barely making subsistence-level wages...
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It's good for those people making those wages who might otherwise be unemployed, or are able to make cash between wages, or add to the primary income.

Ahhhhh fuck it, your right let's go back to the union/token taxi cab model your right.
 
WFcatamount22 said:
It's good for those people making those wages who might otherwise be unemployed, or are able to make cash between wages, or add to the primary income.

Ahhhhh fuck it, your right let's go back to the union/token taxi cab model your right.
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I mean, WalMart employs a lot of people and pays them crap wages, too. Our tax dollars pay for their welfare benefits. Is Wal Mart a social good?

Union/Token taxi cab model was arguably better for traffic congestion in big cities and provided a mobility opportunity for a lot of primarily immigrant workers.

When you don't specify good "for whom," then it's pretty easy to make crap relativistic arguments.
 
ImTheCaptain said:
auto mechanics, road maintenance contractors, service station owners, vehicle and parts manufactures, medical providers, etc.
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Sex work contributes to the economy as well, along with innumerable other exploitative jobs.
 
WFcatamount22 said:
People who put in the risk, capital, thought power, and initiative to invent/start Uber and Lyft cashing in yuge, while millions have been able to make a subsistence living from leveraging the innovation is a GOOD thing though.
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WFcatamount22 said:
Technically right now actually Uber and Lift cant even afford their own cost model, and are losing money hand over fist.
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Can you reconcile these? People with the "thought power" to create a shitty unsustainable model that still loses money while exploiting workers and congesting traffic is a good thing?
 
ITC doesn't believe a sex worker deserves the same dignity as a mechanic. classy.
 
MHBDemon said:
Can you reconcile these? People with the "thought power" to create a shitty unsustainable model that still loses money while exploiting workers and congesting traffic is a good thing?
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The money-loss right now is purposeful - the advantageousness of capital. They have the money to completely destroy an established business model. Ride sharing services are parasitic business models, leeching infrastructure resources, without paying the corresponding regulatory cost. The entire idea is to eradicate taxi services, and make people without transportation alternatives, completely reliant upon them.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
The money-loss right now is purposeful - the advantageousness of capital. They have the money to completely destroy an established business model. Ride sharing services are parasitic business models, leeching infrastructure resources, without paying the corresponding regulatory cost. The entire idea is to eradicate taxi services, and make people without transportation alternatives, completely reliant upon them.
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Yeah I get it. And it's all central to my argument that these companies wield enough lobbying power and economic power to sell these things as "innovations" and people think they are "common sense" solutions to natural phenomenon, rather than just corporate greed.
 
So people like Catamount truly believe these innovations are dreamed up by the best and the brightest and the risk-takers and the entrepreneurs, when they are really just capitalism instituting reforms to preserve its own power.
 
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