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Tuition Forgiveness

Strickland33 said:
not sure if you've been paying attention, but the Biden Administration has been kinda killing it lately in a lot of policy domains

i'm also seeing next to no serious criticism of the debt cancellation. it's all half baked concern trolling from donks like you.

mid-term turnout should be solid
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It seems like voting harder... worked?
 
Rafi said:
It seems like voting harder... worked?
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Not a real thing. “Voting harder” is a sarcastic reference to Democrats frustration with leftists lack of (social media) enthusiasm for general election Dem candidates.
 
Rafi said:
It seems like voting harder... worked?
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Took him about 18 months, but it seems like Biden and his fellow Libs finally grew a set.

I’m proud of him. Keep it up. This is how you win elections. Fuck compromise.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
Not a real thing. “Voting harder” is a sarcastic reference to Democrats frustration with leftists lack of (social media) enthusiasm for general election Dem candidates.
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I’m thinking rafi was being sarcastic right back at the ‘vote harder’ crowd.
 
birdman said:
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EXACTLY!
 
biden had been floating this for months, and he had legal justification to do it based on 2003 heroes act. that wasn't the case for much of what he has barely gotten through congress.

his administration has done a wonderful job getting things done in a very challenging environment.
 
USA Today article on how the GOP hopes to use Biden's student debt plan to regain momentum for the midterms, and why that may be difficult.

"Republicans set out to paint the recipients of up to $20,000 in student loan forgiveness as a handout for wealthy and privileged students at the expense of hard-working Americans.

First attack ad: The American Action Network, which works to elect Republican House candidates, released a 60-second television ad Friday that calls Biden's student loan debt forgives "a bailout for rich kids." The ad, which will air nationwide for the next 10 days, has three narrators: a waitress who says she works two jobs, a lawn worker and an auto mechanic. They're frustrated and perplexed by the president's plan. "Want to be a struggling artist? College is on me," the auto mechanic says. "Enjoy your free ride."

In recent election cycles, Republicans have amassed significant electoral advantages among white voters who lack college degrees, particularly in rural areas. There's a widening education polarization in the U.S. in which college-educated Americans have increasingly voted Democratic and non-college Americans have voted Republican. Look for Republicans to use Biden's student loan cancellation as a targeted wedge to try to peel off even more of these voters in key swing states such as Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and Ohio that have competitive Senate races.

As much as Biden's student loan debt forgiveness presents an opportunity to motivate young voters – who often sit out midterm elections – he's also opened himself up to a new line of attack that could resonate for some. Still, Democrats see a net-plus. A USA TODAY/Public Agenda poll in July found 59% of Americans support forgiving a significant portion of government student for college graduates. A Harvard University poll found that 85% of Americans 18 to 29 years – who overwhelmingly lean Democratic – support some form of government action on student loan debt."

Link: https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-tries-bidens-student-debt-100019634.html
 
That should be a hard sell given that it’s only $10K for people who earn less than $125K. People with Pell grants are the opposite of wealthy kids.

Also it’s common sense that actual wealthy people would have paid off their student loan debt.

An obvious point I almost forgot is the people who will buy that argument are already the base. Republicans have far fewer people to gain than Democrats have.

Here’s another reason it shouldn’t work. You know how many Americans see themselves as future millionaires? Plenty of Americans who don’t have college degrees see themselves as future college students and graduates one day as well. So policies that make going to college easier should be popular among people who haven’t been.

Either way, estimates are somewhere between 45-48 million Americans have student loan debt. Democrats only need 5-10% of them to vote Democrats instead of voting Republican or not voting at all.
 
Rubio: All you have to do to pay off your student loans is to get elected to the Senate, hire a ghostwriter to write you a book, slap your name on the cover, and you're debt free! It's easy!

 
Highland Deac said:
Rubio: All you have to do to pay off your student loans is to get elected to the Senate, hire a ghostwriter to write you a book, slap your name on the cover, and you're debt free! It's easy!

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Why hire a ghostwriter yourself when you can use money from your political donors!

 
avalon said:
Why hire a ghostwriter yourself when you can use money from your political donors!

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That's even better. It also makes the Fox chyron at the bottom of the screen all the more appropriate, although not in the way that Rubio or Fox intended.
 
It's amazing how much easier it is to pay off loans with a 6 figure income, or a windfall from a side gig. 🙄
 
DeacsPop said:
Please tell me you are not serious. I for one would be glad to pay more taxes so people 18-22 can party for 4 years.
We could add a major on "living off the dime of others".
Public education should be accessible and affordable. But free?? Not.
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Quite serious. Public education should free and accessible. Education should be a human right just as healthcare should be. It provides the best chance for allowing the poor to have class mobility, allows the nation to have a top-notch workforce capable of innovation and is our best insurance to preserve our democracy against conspiracy-minded fascists. Reagan infected too many in this country with the disease of selfishness over working for the public good.
 
I'm all for education my friend. And couldn't agree with you more that it is surest gateway out of poverty.
But without drive and ambition (which Reagan preached) advancement to any level is not possible. (A flawed man in many ways, but he was right there.) Educating the masses is a noble cause but not one bit practical nor affordable. We live in a world where success of any kind is only achievable with the willingness to work hard and make sacrifices, no matter the obstacles. We need to help those in need and try to level the playing field where ever possible. But not enable those who can, from achieving.
 
Pop, you should read about how Reagan created this crisis.

https://theintercept.com/2022/08/25/student-loans-debt-reagan/

Prominent conservative intellectuals also took up the charge. Privately one worried that free education “may be producing a positively dangerous class situation” by raising the expectations of working-class students. Another referred to college students as “a parasite feeding on the rest of society” who exhibited a “failure to understand and to appreciate the crucial role played [by] the reward-punishment structure of the market.” The answer was “to close off the parasitic option.”
In practice, this meant to the National Review, a “system of full tuition charges supplemented by loans which students must pay out of their future income.”
In retrospect, this period was the clear turning point in America’s policies toward higher education. For decades, there had been enthusiastic bipartisan agreement that states should fund high-quality public colleges so that their youth could receive higher education for free or nearly so. That has now vanished. In 1968, California residents paid a $300 yearly fee to attend Berkeley, the equivalent of about $2,000 now. Now tuition at Berkeley is $15,000, with total yearly student costs reaching almost $40,000.
Student debt, which had played a minor role in American life through the 1960s, increased during the Reagan administration and then shot up after the 2007-2009 Great Recession as states made huge cuts to funding for their college systems.
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Educating the masses was noble, practical, and affordable until Brown vs. Board. Then public education became a burden and conservatives turned against public education.

Plenty of people don't work hard for success. Many of them do work to make it harder and harder for others to work hard and get where they are.
 
I fail to see how expanding free public education through college has anything to do with removing drive and ambition. You will still need drive and ambition to get an education even if you no longer face a lifetime of crippling debt once you’ve graduated.
 
Also, making higher education affordable or free wouldn't mean unqualified people would start all the sudden being admitted to top schools. It would just mean that talented people wouldn't be so limited by their upbringing or social class or race
 
I believe Georgia has (or used to have) a system where any high schooler with a 3.0 or better got a free ride to a state public school. They also have to maintain the 3.0 each semester, I think. So even if they get their degree in lesbian dance theory, at least you know they are learning it well.
 
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