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Wake / Jacksonville Game Thread...

My rec team could have scored almost every time against their zone. It was one of the weakest I've ever seen. It really showed we have neither a point or any coaching.
 
I see that most think Jax is a really horrible team, but if I was a fan of them, I'd be encouraged by what I saw last night. They didn't have their best player, McDougald, available, and they're working two grad student transfers into the lineup. Also thought Chris Hunt, the freshman from Greensboro, looked really good. He gives them an outside threat that's lacking from the rest of the team. I also liked that they had multiple players who could penetrate and finish.

My guess is they'll do well in the A-Sun once they get used to the new players. I realize Wake is not the most talented team around, but can't believe many A-Sun teams have more talent than we do.
 
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Just a couple thoughts: obviously discouraging that this was even a game after the way it started. I disagree with the poster above. We were clearly the more talented and athletic team and yet this was a dog fight in the second half.

Coron Williams is a liability on defense. He can't guard anybody in the open floor. We've been playing him at point a good bit and when they grab a long rebound its just an automatic lay up because he can't stop the ball. His shooting will offset this on some nights, but man, Jones needs to step up. I'd much rather have Coron as an asset off the bench than a regular PG.
 
I dunno. Coron's pretty quick and is a nice athlete. He almost had a put-back dunk last night when he was following a fast break - he's just small.

He's looked bad on defense a few times because we've been switching everything - when Moto switches off a 6'8" guy and gives him to Coron, we're going to have problems. Another example was when Codi got switched to one of their big guys. He drifted back and made a nice effort but honestly the guy just fumbled the lob and should have had a dunk. The opposite is true for Cav - when he leaves his guy and gets tossed outside on a guard with any skill he's just going to drive right by him.

[Redacted]'s an NBA guy, I have to assume he understands matchups and won't keep running this defense against better teams. But who knows.

Still think I like Codi and Coron starting over Madison so far. Madison is just so limited on offense and really isn't that great a passer. Just has a nice handle and a quick feet. It's not like Codi is a spot-up shooter and having him handle the ball more hurts his game much.
 
TwentyONE said:
Just a couple thoughts: obviously discouraging that this was even a game after the way it started. I disagree with the poster above. We were clearly the more talented and athletic team and yet this was a dog fight in the second half.

Coron Williams is a liability on defense. He can't guard anybody in the open floor. We've been playing him at point a good bit and when they grab a long rebound its just an automatic lay up because he can't stop the ball. His shooting will offset this on some nights, but man, Jones needs to step up. I'd much rather have Coron as an asset off the bench than a regular PG.
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I don't recall comparing our athleticism and talent with Jax. I said if I was a fan of their team I'd be encouraged by what I saw. Reading is fundamental.
 
Deac83 said:
In the bizarre world of Bzz tonight was progress. This is exactly the game we would lose the last 3 years. Instead of the traditional 1 step forward two back, this was just one step back. Not a great game but they pulled it together in the end.

We'll find out next week what the truth is about this team. At this point I've been surprised we are scoring so well. The losing CJ was supposed to be the demise of our offense.

Yes the competition is weak, but we've scored 80+ in 3 of 4 games. Last year we scored 80+ 4 times in total. This year 90 twice, last year 90 once.

If, and it's a big if, Coron continues to shoot well from the outside, when you have Devin inside, CMM strong enough to drive the lane and finish and getting consistent play from Travis, we will get our points. The defense might not stop the other team from scoring but we should be able to put up some solid number on the offensive end with an inside and outside game.
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The gameplan against us is quite simple.

1. Try to get Devin in foul trouble early.
2. Play zone defense ALL GAME no matter what.
3. Play whatever offense you want because we can't stop anything.

An average or better team that does these things will beat us 9 out of 10 times.
 
TwentyONE said:
Coron Williams is a liability on defense. He can't guard anybody in the open floor. We've been playing him at point a good bit and when they grab a long rebound its just an automatic lay up because he can't stop the ball. His shooting will offset this on some nights, but man, Jones needs to step up. I'd much rather have Coron as an asset off the bench than a regular PG.
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I disagree. I think Coron plays better defense than our other guards, though I realize that's not saying much. For example, against PC, they really only had two guys that could score - Downing and Dillard. Whenever Coron guarded one of those guys, he shut them down, especially on Downing in the second half (and Downing was a tall guard). I haven't seen any of our other guards play better defense than that this year.

Last night I thought Wake should have switched to a 2-3 zone once it became clear we couldn't stop them from driving the lane. I think more zones should be played this year in general because of the new emphasis on calling hand-checks.
 
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Rafi said:
Last night I thought Wake should have switched to a 2-3 zone once it became clear we couldn't stop them from driving the lane. I think more zones should be played this year in general because of the new emphasis on calling hand-checks.
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Totally agree with both points. Once it became obvious we couldn't stop penetration, we definitely should've tried it. I think coaches will be slow to make the adjustment to zone though, just like football coaches were slow to take advantage of kickoff touchbacks being brought out to the 25.

The FSU game last year where their coaches totally punked ours by kicking off just short of the goal line was sad and hilarious at the same time.
 
It cracks me up that the sunshine brigade is pointing towards this game to show our improvement. We barely beat a sub 250 team at home.
 
ChrisL68 said:
It cracks me up that the sunshine brigade is pointing towards this game to show our improvement. We barely beat a sub 250 team at home.
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To which post are you referring?
 
Rafi said:
I disagree. I think Coron plays better defense than our other guards, though I realize that's not saying much. For example, against PC, they really only had two guys that could score - Downing and Dillard. Whenever Coron guarded one of those guys, he shut them down, especially on Downing in the second half (and Downing was a tall guard). I haven't seen any of our other guards play better defense than that this year.

Last night I thought Wake should have switched to a 2-3 zone once it became clear we couldn't stop them from driving the lane. I think more zones should be played this year in general because of the new emphasis on calling hand-checks.
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Let's see how Coron does against a D1 sized backcourt, ok? Everybody was pitiful on D against Jacksonville. Every single player. Stats =\= defense.
 
ChrisL68 said:
It cracks me up that the sunshine brigade is pointing towards this game to show our improvement. We barely beat a sub 250 team at home.
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I saw improvement from the opening tip McKie and co. whipped their asses...from the first 3 seconds after the tip to being up 33-17 -- fast.

If Buzz bears some blame then it is for having been too eager to get the subs minutes. It quelled the momentum and made the game a multiple story line. Had he left the starters in then WF would have been up 25 by halftime. It wasn't even close. But that's college ball...he had CMM telling the journal that they need to beat teams like this by 30 or more and not let up. But they did...in an effort to expand the pool of guys with meaningful minutes.

I never thought Jax would win the game and that echoes Miller Mac's assessment. Last year, different story.

Good win.
 
Strickland33 said:
Let's see how Coron does against a D1 sized backcourt, ok? Everybody was pitiful on D against Jacksonville. Every single player. Stats =\= defense.
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Nowhere did anyone mention "stats," so I'm not sure I understand the point of reference regarding your assertion that "stats =/= defense." I just said that I thought Coron played better on-the-ball defense than our other guards, particularly in the PC game against their 6'5" guard/forward.

Of course the teams Wake has played so far do not have ACC quality guards, everyone knows that, but compared to the other Wake guards I think Coron has looked the best defensively. Might it look different against ACC guards? It might, and I hope it does especially if it means the other guards are defending better.

I agree that everyone looked pitiful defensively against Jacksonville. That's why I thought a switch to zone was warranted.
 
Dumb question that nobody probably knows the answer to, but...

One of the JVille players was wearing low cut blue nike's with bright green trim. Any idea what they were?
 
Rafi said:
Nowhere did anyone mention "stats," so I'm not sure I understand the point of reference regarding your assertion that "stats =/= defense." I just said that I thought Coron played better on-the-ball defense than our other guards, particularly in the PC game against their 6'5" guard/forward.

Of course the teams Wake has played so far do not have ACC quality guards, everyone knows that, but compared to the other Wake guards I think Coron has looked the best defensively. Might it look different against ACC guards? It might, and I hope it does especially if it means the other guards are defending better.

I agree that everyone looked pitiful defensively against Jacksonville. That's why I thought a switch to zone was warranted.
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Jax was held to 1 point on their last 7 possessions and out rebounded 57 to 40 for the game
 
Lectro said:
Jax was held to 1 point on their last 7 possessions and out rebounded 57 to 40 for the game
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Did you watch the game? Serious question because from my vantage point, those numbers resulted more from the fact that Jacksonville is not good at basketball because it certainly wasn't due to a lack of good looks...
 
Lectro said:
Jax was held to 1 point on their last 7 possessions and out rebounded 57 to 40 for the game
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That's not true. They hit a 3 pointer with 49 seconds left and another with 26 seconds left. So they actually had 6 points on their last 4 possessions.
 
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