Wake - Richmond Game Thread

[RChildress107]

Well, I have no defense for Bzz. However, Travis still can't guard the four. He would be a great role player on a team with better pieces. We are not that team and he is not a great fit for what we have currently. He gets by but that is about it. It is not all on him. I just personally feel that he doesn't give his all and that is on him. I hold coworkers accountable in the same way even if they dont like the boss.

depends on who the four is.

Also it's not like we don't have the pieces to mix things up on offense. There's no rule that your third tallest player must be your 3 on offense and must never go to the post. With Cav's ability to shoot the three it's not that difficult to send Travis to the block every once and a while, especially when he's being guarded by an undersized 3.

How would you treat your coworker in the following situation:

He gets hired to be in charge of IT. He's good at it and everyone is excited for him to take over. However, due to some departures the company is left without lead account manager. He's the best you've got and so even though it's not what he's best at he takes over anyways. The company goes through some really rough times but everyone says it would have been even worse if your coworker hadn't stepped up. In his fourth year with the company a young guy steps up and volunteers to take over as lead account manager. Your coworker is relieved because he can go back to doing what he does best. Instead the CEO sends him over to HR.

Your coworker is pissed, has never really liked the CEO and probably realizes that the CEO would have been fired if it weren't for him. He could probably work 25% harder at his HR job but he just kind of coasts instead. He's still relatively productive but it's noticeable that HR isn't running as smoothly as it could.

Are you really going to go pull that coworker aside and tell him to step it up? I doubt it.

 

[WRS]

There is no 5th year option IMO. We either are going to see an extension or a firing. Lame duck head coaches can't recruit.

Bz already can't recruit.

[insert laugh track]

 

[WRS]

We run an inside out offense, I don't think it's that surprising that we get the ball to Devin a lot. Besides he isn't really struggling too badly, he had 11 and 19 yesterday.

4-14 from the floor though yesterday.

 

[forensicdeac]

depends on who the four is.

Also it's not like we don't have the pieces to mix things up on offense. There's no rule that your third tallest player must be your 3 on offense and must never go to the post. With Cav's ability to shoot the three it's not that difficult to send Travis to the block every once and a while, especially when he's being guarded by an undersized 3.

How would you treat your coworker in the following situation:

He gets hired to be in charge of IT. He's good at it and everyone is excited for him to take over. However, due to some departures the company is left without lead account manager. He's the best you've got and so even though it's not what he's best at he takes over anyways. The company goes through some really rough times but everyone says it would have been even worse if your coworker hadn't stepped up. In his fourth year with the company a young guy steps up and volunteers to take over as lead account manager. Your coworker is relieved because he can go back to doing what he does best. Instead the CEO sends him over to HR.

Your coworker is pissed, has never really liked the CEO and probably realizes that the CEO would have been fired if it weren't for him. He could probably work 25% harder at his HR job but he just kind of coasts instead. He's still relatively productive but it's noticeable that HR isn't running as smoothly as it could.

Are you really going to go pull that coworker aside and tell him to step it up? I doubt it.

Well, you don't know me then. If my coworker's coasting through his job directly affects me and my work product, then you bet I will say something. Not only that, if it is noticeable and that person represents my company then it is also a reflection on me.

We just clearly don't agree on whether or not it is acceptable to mail it in if you think someone did you wrong. That's fine. Agree to disagree.

 

[ACCOffice]

4-14 from the floor though yesterday.

Devin's rebounding and outlet passing yesterday was fantastic. He worked his rear end off. Several rebounds that others picked up came from him keeping the ball alive. Also showed some stuff off the dribble. Great job of getting to the rim from the post also. If he makes half of the point blank layups he missed it was a tremendous day.

 

[Deacon2002]

Devin's rebounding and outlet passing yesterday was fantastic. He worked his rear end off. Several rebounds that others picked up came from him keeping the ball alive. Also showed some stuff off the dribble. Great job of getting to the rim from the post also. If he makes half of the point blank layups he missed it was a tremendous day.

Great points and kudos to Devin for continuing to work and hustle instead of getting down, sulking, and disappearing b/c his shot wasn't falling.

 

[88Deac]

Devin has admittedly been struggling on offense since the cupcake opening 5 games. I'm not saying abandon him at all. Quite the opposite. But give Travis some opportunities in the post, too. Especially if the best post defender is on Devin. Travis is a proven scorer and rebounder in the post, even when he was the only threat.

 

[88Deac]

Let me be clear I am not down on Devin at all. But mix it up some and take a little pressure off him. He doesn't have to be the only low post option.

 

[Tobacco Road]

The coaches need to reassure Devin he can take some pressure off of himself with some quick passes back out to the perimeter. It is almost a given that he is going to try to bull his way to the basket if he gets the ball in the post. Therefore, it is a pretty solid gamble to double team him once that happens, as he is not currently likely to hurt you by hitting the open man. We tweak that a little and we get some open outside shots and Devin gets easier baskets around the hoop. He has done that better in the past, so he may just be pressing a bit to get back in rhythm.
I agree with trying to get him touches on most possessions to free up others. He just has to know that he can get the ball back if he passes.
I was pretty unimpressed with our movement on offense in general yesterday. We did next to nothing to free up Coron, whose primary role is to shoot. We also were very passive, not forcing them to help out (other than when passing to Devin) to free up other guys or get them off balance. We actually have some guys that can score now, so we need to do just that.
Happy to see Andre getting some good minutes and doing well. I would still be very nervous with him getting significant minutes in league play, but so far he has performed well. He needs some more strength and to be a bit more under control blocking shots, but he is not far from being a good defense player. Much of that will depend on how much strength he can gain after the season. He has yet to show he can hold his position in the low post and take it strong to the basket. So far, he has drifted from the basket, but has made them. With a bit more body control, he can also be a threat on the offensive glass. He could be a solid option along side Devin, who will do the yeoman's work. Could be.

 

[DCDeac]

People are down on Travis because when you average 13 and 8 as a freshman most would expect big things in the future, especially on teams lacking in talent. Instead he's remained roughly the same player he's always been. He hasn't developed a post game, his ball handling and passing remain poor, he still puts his head down on drives and turns it over too often, and he hasn't gotten any stronger. He's a step slow against quality 3's in the ACC and he plays too small to cover quality 4's. Cav spent a summer in the weight room and is stealing his garbage rebounds as a sophomore.

Nobody's saying he isn't a solid player. But this is a guy who had 11 games of 20 points or more as a sophomore. As a junior and senior he's had 4. His overall numbers aren't down because he's getting fewer minutes, he's getting fewer minutes because he's not effective.

 

[ACCOffice]

Let me be clear I am not down on Devin at all. But mix it up some and take a little pressure off him. He doesn't have to be the only low post option.

Exactly. He is such a good passer pulling him out occasionally and posting Travis and Cav would work. He is also great at finding the open wing if there is a double down.

 

[RChildress107]

Well, you don't know me then. If my coworker's coasting through his job directly affects me and my work product, then you bet I will say something. Not only that, if it is noticeable and that person represents my company then it is also a reflection on me.

We just clearly don't agree on whether or not it is acceptable to mail it in if you think someone did you wrong. That's fine. Agree to disagree.

Fair enough but percentage wise in that situation how much blame would you put on the CEO and how much on your coworker?

 

[RJKarl]

You can see it in the players' eyes. They want to do the right thing, but they haven't been coached properly.

We've got some pieces, [Redacted] has no clue how to use them.

As 75 & I said last year, Dre has good hands and feet. He also seems to be a sponge and wants to learn. He could be a good player with a good coach. This is sad.

 

[Strickland33]

Well, you don't know me then. If my coworker's coasting through his job directly affects me and my work product, then you bet I will say something. Not only that, if it is noticeable and that person represents my company then it is also a reflection on me.

We just clearly don't agree on whether or not it is acceptable to mail it in if you think someone did you wrong. That's fine. Agree to disagree.

Travis doesn't seem to be hurting us, though. It goes back to doofus's post identifying expectations as disappointing. I would guess that this is as
efficient with the ball as we have ever been under Buzz, in large part IMO because of Travis not jacking bad shots.

We are 8-2 with.CMM and Devin looking like studs and with Madison and Tyler looking much improved. How had Travis hurt us exactly?

 

[Strickland33]

Devin has admittedly been struggling on offense since the cupcake opening 5 games. I'm not saying abandon him at all. Quite the opposite. But give Travis some opportunities in the post, too. Especially if the best post defender is on Devin. Travis is a proven scorer and rebounder in the post, even when he was the only threat.

You have to give him opportunities, though, and he just has not seen anything given to him in Buzz's offense. He's fourth banana out there.

 

[WRS]

I think DCDeac has it right. People are disappointed because Travis simply hasn't improved at all in 4 years. I don't think you could point to one aspect of his game that has evolved.

 

[Turd Ferguson]

Oops wrong thread.

 

[TheIshThatSaved WakeForest]

I think DCDeac has it right. People are disappointed because Travis simply hasn't improved at all in 4 years. I don't think you could point to one aspect of his game that has evolved.

At least he was pretty good when he showed up to Wake.

 

[Strickland33]

I think DCDeac has it right. People are disappointed because Travis simply hasn't improved at all in 4 years. I don't think you could point to one aspect of his game that has evolved.

That's fine, but he was like this last year, too. There is just no upshot to this conversation. That's my point.

Travis taking a back seat to guys like CMM and Cav, for instance, has allowed our offense to put points on the board in different ways, which definitely didn't happen last year. Featuring Travis resulted in some 20 point games, but it also produced a fairly stagnant offense, in which our best player was deferring to a guy who was streaky at best in the one capacity we utilized him in...

As long as Travis is passing the ball, not turning it over, and showing more restraint as a jump shooter, then I'm fine with what he's doing.

As for rebounding, he's rebounding at the same rate that he was as a sophomore and, believe it or not, grabbing a greater percentage of Wake's overall rebounds during his time on the floor than Cav (though Cav has him beat in per 40 pace adjusted and in defensive rebounding %). He's never been a fundamental rebounder, but he gets his paws on boards that fall his way.

I just think it's silly to expect Travis to do more, while his not doing more may actually be making us better. Just my two cents.

 

[VaDeac]

I've always said that Travis was a good player but not good enough to be the #1 on an ACC team. He just was out of necessity.

Well, now it appears he is #2 or #3, which he should be.