Disco Dan Talks FSU Debacle

[Ayo]

The best detail to debunk this "culture" myth is the fact that Tony Woods left after being given an ultimatum to sit out a year and then come back after. He himself chose to leave, he was not kicked off by [Redacted].

Gary Clark being a captain Buzz's first season and Ty Walker being allowed back because he's tall are also pretty good details.

 

[Strickland33]

The Tony Chennault situation, too, is a pretty good one. Granted, that kid had a ton of legitimate reasons for leaving, but being told that he was losing his starting job to a player who hadn't even stepped foot on campus (and who was worse as a freshman than Tony was as a sophomore, btw) was vintage culture.

Devin's antics and Twitter feed are also solid cases-in-point. What a punk.

 

[ChrisL68]

I think Wellman hired Bzzz under the idea that Bzzz would probably recruit mostly 4 year type players. Once a whole bunch of bad stuff happened with the team, this morphed into the culture narrative.

Also, it was doubtful Bzzz was going to be fired under 3 or 4 years with the big buyout we had to deal with Dino.

 

[PhDeac]

The big buyout was Wellman's fault too.

 

[TreFoDeac]

Ever thought maybe the players are tanking so that Bzz gets fired after this season?

 

[RChildress107]

This has never been about Wellman's pride. He asked Bz to do something with the program (part 1) and then expected Bz to win at a Stevens-like level once he got a team of his players (part 2). Bz did what Wellman asked so in Wellman's mind, Bz was successful at part 1. And I don't give a rats ass about what he asked Bz to do and it really doesn't matter, it was asked and Bz was given slack to do it and he did whatever it was. But Bz is now not winning and has failed at part 2 so he's gone.

Bz was going to get his chance and that was how it was going to play out from the beginning. Wellman was not going to go back on his word. The onus was on Bz to succeed with his kids, not Wellman. It's now a VERY easy decision to make and we move on. Maybe after he's gone and all the hate fades away, more people will realize it.

If that is true, which I highly doubt it is, then Wellman deserves to be fired.

1. It would mean he asked [Redacted] to rebuild something that didn't need to be rebuilded. Using an unneccessary model ill suited for ACC basketball.

2. It would mean Wellman completely missed obvious signs that [Redacted] was not up to the job.

3. It would mean Wellman missed obvious signs along the way that [Redacted] was not going to accomplish what he was asking. Even using the "he needed his players" nonsense the evidence was clear last year that even with his players he wasn't going to accomplish what was asked of him.

4. It would mean Wellman asked or allowed [Redacted] to beg the 2010 class to come to Wake even though both Wellman and [Redacted] knew that many of those players were likely ill suited for [Redacted]'s "system" and style.

 

[Maztal]

the entire [Redacted] hire was amateur hour on Wellman's part (captain obvious, i know)

you fire a head coach who just won a game in the NCAA Tournament, retain his assistants and hire a guy who did a terrible job at Colorado.

 

[IckerDeac]

The original roadmap had us in a Final Four in year 4 or 5. Wellman thought we needed a fine tuning and not a complete overhaul. He seriously fucked up the evalution of Mr. Aspergers.

 

[RacerDeac]

Pourdeac reminds me of Wellman... they both think they're the smartest person in the room and are the only one who can see the real truth that the rest of us somehow miss.

 

[RacerDeac]

The original roadmap had us in a Final Four in year 4 or 5. Wellman thought we needed a fine tuning and not a complete overhaul. He seriously fucked up the evalution of Mr. Aspergers.

If he truly believed that, why did he allow Buzz to come in and blow up the program in year 1? Then again, he's a guy that looked at the facts and still thought Buzz was the guy to make those changes...

 

[Ayo]

pourdeac lives in an alternate universe. That's really the only explanation for his posts.

 

[IckerDeac]

If he truly believed that, why did he allow Buzz to come in and blow up the program in year 1?

The blowup wasn't necessarily pre-planned. Ari and JT had drug issues and needed to move on and we all know about Woods. After that, Bzzz had an excuse as to why it would take longer. He sold everyone that this Soph class was the cavalry and he'd win with 'his guys.' Now that it has been well established that Bzzz simply cannot win with anyone, the writing is on the wall or so it seems.

 

[TheReff]

So many good friends of mine have stuck with the program through these dark days without questioning Bzz or Ron. I know they will give Ron a pass and post a "Go Deacs" when a new hire is made. I wish they would question how we came to this pass, but they won't. It's going to take years to rebuild the flagship program. Years. And if you go back to the days after Skip died it really didn't have to play out this way. I have a heavy heart about the program. I know it's just basketball but I love Wake Forest and when I watch us lose like we did tonight I makes me sick. What makes me sadder is I am not sure Ron Wellman is going to swallow his pride and do the right thing for Wake Forest. If he doesn't he should be fired.

He should never have gotten rid of Dave Odom or George Greer, just for the sake of hiring his own coaches and putting his own stamp on the athletic department. What he did was get rid of a 240 win basketball coach with 2 ACC titles, who would have been here a long time and made the university proud just Like Jim Boeheim at Syracuse. And he got rid of over 600 baseball wins and 3 ACC titles after only 1 losing season and only 2 years removed from the 3rd of 4 years of ACC titles and he would have been here forever, just like Mike Martin at Florida State. Instead we have the situations we are in now because of Ron's ego.

 

[Ball State Deac]

If he truly believed that, why did he allow Buzz to come in and blow up the program in year 1? Then again, he's a guy that looked at the facts and still thought Buzz was the guy to make those changes...

He honest to God believed [Redacted] was the right man for the job. I suspect Wellman was shocked by just how bad the first year was. IIRC, my general sense at the time of the hire was that Wellman really thought the program just needed a tweak, and he was probably right. Instead of tweak though, we got the twat that is [Redacted].

 

[RacerDeac]

The blowup wasn't necessarily pre-planned. Ari and JT had drug issues and needed to move on and we all know about Woods.

You don't think Buzz helped drive those guys away? He did it at CO too. If the "leader" and adult that a kid spends more time with than any other adult in their life makes a kid feel Iike shit, I'm not surprised that a kid would get out of control and/or act out. And let's not pretend that our AD, under Wellman's "leadership", went out of their way to further the bad eggs narrative when they had done the opposite in the past and ever since.

 

[IMissRandolph]

Wellman hired [Redacted] on a "hunch", he has said this in multiple interviews. The fact that the President and BOT have allowed this "hunch" to destroy the Wake program shows there's virtually no accountability at the school

 

[Strickland33]

The blowup wasn't necessarily pre-planned. Ari and JT had drug issues and needed to move on and we all know about Woods. After that, Bzzz had an excuse as to why it would take longer. He sold everyone that this Soph class was the cavalry and he'd win with 'his guys.' Now that it has been well established that Bzzz simply cannot win with anyone, the writing is on the wall or so it seems.

I don't buy your take on Ari and JT. If JT's problems were so well known than why in the hell did our staff allow it to get bad to the point where he passed out, high and drunk, behind the wheel of a car? Same with Ari - why not just kick him out of school if it was that bad? Ari definitely made the move by himself and JT's condition deteriorated into a mutual parting of ways. Either way, Wake really looks like shit in both of those cases.

 

[ChrisL68]

He should never have gotten rid of Dave Odom or George Greer, just for the sake of hiring his own coaches and putting his own stamp on the athletic department. What he did was get rid of a 240 win basketball coach with 2 ACC titles, who would have been here a long time and made the university proud just Like Jim Boeheim at Syracuse. And he got rid of over 600 baseball wins and 3 ACC titles after only 1 losing season and only 2 years removed from the 3rd of 4 years of ACC titles and he would have been here forever, just like Mike Martin at Florida State. Instead we have the situations we are in now because of Ron's ego.

Nope, both would have likely turned into Jim Grobe situations where people would have complained about them staying too long. Heck, Odom was here 4 years after his big success with one tourney, so he did pretty much turn into a Jim Grobe situation.

 

[mothersodear]

I still believe that, after getting turned down by his lead candidates, RW sort of panicked and called up his old buddy, Bz. He promised him assistants and 4 full years if he would just come to Wake. And he kept his word.

 

[Ball State Deac]

I still believe that, after getting turned down by his lead candidates, RW sort of panicked and called up his old buddy, Bz. He promised him assistants and 4 full years if he would just come to Wake. And he kept his word.

I think that's too generous. I suspect Wellman always wanted [Redacted].