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Biological male wins women’s cycling event

MysteryMen said:
Why? How are those two related? The purpose of a sex change isn't to enable someone to have sex
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Not my point. Why do we have ages of consent? Why are you a dependent of your parents until a certain age? Why is there a drinking age of 21?
 
Of course a Pack fan would use a trans boy winning a girls' wrestling title to argue in favor of ditching age of consent laws.
 
PhDeac said:
Of course a Pack fan would use a trans boy winning a girls' wrestling title to argue in favor of ditching age of consent laws.
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Side question: Men and women wrestle each other in NC high schools, no? They did when I wrestled, at least.
 
Strickland33 said:
Side question: Men and women wrestle each other in NC high schools, no? They did when I wrestled, at least.
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I couldn't believe Texas has a league for women to wrestle each other. Most Texas thing ever?
 
Strickland33 said:
Side question: Men and women wrestle each other in NC high schools, no? They did when I wrestled, at least.
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Last I heard. They only have weight classes which makes sense.
 
What's the easy answer for the NCAA/ACC as to why they have competition divisions broken down by sex but object to North Carolina having the same distinction for adjusting gross weight?
 
tintinisahottie said:
Not my point. Why do we have ages of consent? Why are you a dependent of your parents until a certain age? Why is there a drinking age of 21?
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I don't get your point. It's a medical procedure. We allow parents to consent to medical procedures on behalf of their dependent children
 
One of the biggest roles a parent plays is making sure their child is as happy as possible. There is evidence that transgender people know as early as 4-5 years old that they identify as a gender that does not match their biological sex. I applaud those parents that have communication lines open with their children at early enough ages to allow them to transition to their true gender early enough to preempt the changes that puberty has on their bodies. They are making their child's lives easier in the long run, not harder, and giving them the ultimate happiness: being comfortable in their own bodies.
 
MysteryMen said:
Is this just a personal opinion? How do you feel about parents letting their kids be gay?
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It's my opinion, and therefore the correct opinion. Being gay and being trans are two completely different issues. Did you not know the tomboy girl growing up? Or the feminine boy who maybe turned out to be gay or maybe didn't? These kids relate to the opposite sex a bit more than normal. And kids growing up, either when they're in the pretend stage of their life or in the emotional turmoil that constitutes adolescence, are going to be all over the map with how they feel and who they identify with. The current fad would be to lump them in as trans. It makes me sick. The gay kid can at least bide his team and make sure that whatever he is feeling is actually the way he is. He can say, hey dudes give me boners and now I'll go make out with one and see if everything still gives me a boner, or maybe I'll try to make out with a chick and see if that gives me a boner. What's the option for the trans kid? Oh, we're gonna dress you up as the opposite sex and maybe cut your cock off and hope that you don't actually grow out of it by the time you mature. Yeah, great plan.
 
EatLeadCommie said:
It's my opinion, and therefore the correct opinion. Being gay and being trans are two completely different issues. Did you not know the tomboy girl growing up? Or the feminine boy who maybe turned out to be gay or maybe didn't? These kids relate to the opposite sex a bit more than normal. And kids growing up, either when they're in the pretend stage of their life or in the emotional turmoil that constitutes adolescence, are going to be all over the map with how they feel and who they identify with. The current fad would be to lump them in as trans. It makes me sick. The gay kid can at least bide his team and make sure that whatever he is feeling is actually the way he is. He can say, hey dudes give me boners and now I'll go make out with one and see if everything still gives me a boner, or maybe I'll try to make out with a chick and see if that gives me a boner. What's the option for the trans kid? Oh, we're gonna dress you up as the opposite sex and maybe cut your cock off and hope that you don't actually grow out of it by the time you mature. Yeah, great plan.
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Clearly, you know nothing about this topic. Why don't you go take a walk around the block, grab a beer, sit down, and then just sit for a minute.
 
AsesinoDeTortugas said:
One of the biggest roles a parent plays is making sure their child is as happy as possible. There is evidence that transgender people know as early as 4-5 years old that they identify as a gender that does not match their biological sex. I applaud those parents that have communication lines open with their children at early enough ages to allow them to transition to their true gender early enough to preempt the changes that puberty has on their bodies. They are making their child's lives easier in the long run, not harder, and giving them the ultimate happiness: being comfortable in their own bodies.
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This is bullshit. Being a parent is not just about making sure your child is as happy as possible, but some parents think it's a popularity contest to act on every whim, particularly after a divorce. Depriving them of everything they want is part of parenting, part of protecting them, and part of helping them learn that you can't always get what you want, or what they think they want. A 4-5 year old kid barely knows how to not shit his pants, much less what gender he identifies with. Gimme a break. "Preempt the changes that puberty has on their bodies." Puberty is what ultimately makes them who they are, not sexual reassignment that preempts that. Such nonsense.
 
AsesinoDeTortugas said:
Clearly, you know nothing about this topic. Why don't you go take a walk around the block, grab a beer, sit down, and then just sit for a minute.
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Ah yes. The "you aren't us so you can't understand". There's nothing to understand. If you're an adult and feel like you gotta pull a Caitlyn Jenner, feel free. You'll be a weirdo in my book, but I think you can live with that. You gotta live with the consequences of deception too at some point. But if you're a kid with these issues, and you're a parent pushing your kid in this direction, and you're a health professional pushing them in that direction, well then you're just a piece of shit.
 
EatLeadCommie said:
This is bullshit. Being a parent is not just about making sure your child is as happy as possible, but some parents think it's a popularity contest to act on every whim, particularly after a divorce. Depriving them of everything they want is part of parenting, part of protecting them, and part of helping them learn that you can't always get what you want, or what they think they want. A 4-5 year old kid barely knows how to not shit his pants, much less what gender he identifies with. Gimme a break. "Preempt the changes that puberty has on their bodies." Puberty is what ultimately makes them who they are, not sexual reassignment that preempts that. Such nonsense.
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Well divorce has nothing to do with this "conversation" we are having in this thread, so that's one thing.

"Depriving them of everything they want is part of parenting..." is the real nonsense. That's how children learn to resent their parents, and in extreme cases, hate their parents. That's where the aforementioned communication plays a big role. Depriving them for deprivation's sake, because they don't know what they want, is an abysmal parenting technique. Authoritarian parenting is proven to be one of the least effective styles of parenting in developing grounded, happy children.

In many ways, a 4-5 year old knows what they feel better than a 7-11 year old child, or an adolescent, or a young adult. When you are 4-5, you have not developed the capability to lie convincingly. Things are black and white to young children. The research is still in early stages, but it's not as if a boy is saying, "I like to wear dresses and play with dolls." He will say, "I am a girl."

I know that it won't convince you in any way, shape, or form. But, still felt like someone had to try to set the record straight.
 
EatLeadCommie said:
Ah yes. The "you aren't us so you can't understand". There's nothing to understand. If you're an adult and feel like you gotta pull a Caitlyn Jenner, feel free. You'll be a weirdo in my book, but I think you can live with that. You gotta live with the consequences of deception too at some point. But if you're a kid with these issues, and you're a parent pushing your kid in this direction, and you're a health professional pushing them in that direction, well then you're just a piece of shit.
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I have never heard of a single case where a parent or health professional pushed a child, at any age, towards gender transition. It happens about as often as a person transitions so they can molest little girls in the girl's bathroom.
 
ELC, do you believe at all that a person can be born with a gender identity different than their biological sex?

If no, then the direction this conversation went makes much more sense.
 
EatLeadCommie said:
It's my opinion, and therefore the correct opinion. Being gay and being trans are two completely different issues. Did you not know the tomboy girl growing up? Or the feminine boy who maybe turned out to be gay or maybe didn't? These kids relate to the opposite sex a bit more than normal. And kids growing up, either when they're in the pretend stage of their life or in the emotional turmoil that constitutes adolescence, are going to be all over the map with how they feel and who they identify with. The current fad would be to lump them in as trans. It makes me sick. The gay kid can at least bide his team and make sure that whatever he is feeling is actually the way he is. He can say, hey dudes give me boners and now I'll go make out with one and see if everything still gives me a boner, or maybe I'll try to make out with a chick and see if that gives me a boner. What's the option for the trans kid? Oh, we're gonna dress you up as the opposite sex and maybe cut your cock off and hope that you don't actually grow out of it by the time you mature. Yeah, great plan.
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So there are two separate issues here:

1. As far as a physical transformation, I'm pretty sure almost all doctors refuse to do gender reassignment surgery on people under 18 years old. So no issues there, you don't have to worry about parents ruining their kids that way

2. But dressing like someone of the gender that you identify with? How is that any different than kissing a guy to see if he gives you a boner? It's harmless, and if you feel differently later, reversible. In other words, if you think that you're identifying with a different gender, how can you know until you try to conform with that gender and see if it's what you're comfortable with? And if the kid says that this is how he's feeling, are the parents supposed to try to talk him out of it? How is that any different than saying parents should talk their children out of being gay?
 
MysteryMen said:
So there are two separate issues here:

1. As far as a physical transformation, I'm pretty sure almost all doctors refuse to do gender reassignment surgery on people under 18 years old. So no issues there, you don't have to worry about parents ruining their kids that way

2. But dressing like someone of the gender that you identify with? How is that any different than kissing a guy to see if he gives you a boner? It's harmless, and if you feel differently later, reversible. In other words, if you think that you're identifying with a different gender, how can you know until you try to conform with that gender and see if it's what you're comfortable with? And if the kid says that this is how he's feeling, are the parents supposed to try to talk him out of it? How is that any different than saying parents should talk their children out of being gay?
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Or, likewise, when parents of intersex children "choose," with doctors' inputs, their newborn children's genders shortly after birth, which is actually pretty common.
 
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