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America's White People Are In Deep Shit

Demonbeck said:
I am saying that Big Pharma consists of for-profit companies who create products that have a nearly infinite demand. These for-profit companies have been very successful in protecting and promoting their industry. It is not incumbent upon them to enforce the laws of the land. That is the role of government.
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So how exactly are they different from street level drug pushers?
 
Well fast food would need to be straight up lying to you and telling you the food you were eating wasn't bad for you, then you would also become chemically dependent on the fast food, you also wouldn't know any better and would need to just trust the fast food worker to give you what they think is best, then finally you would need to eat like 5 hamburgers because you were given that many.
 
Are pharmaceutical companies to blame for falsifying or paying to bury studies about the addictiveness of their drugs? Or for the fact that oxycontin doesn't have increased efficacy over older drugs (but is far more addictive), but nearly a billion was spent marketing it to docs? Or the fact that the 12 hr cycle is more or less manufactured with the intent of forming a habit?

This is basically the ultimate litmus test for why corporations aren't people. A single person that produced this much public health risk to a population would be in jail, much like docs and pharmacists who set up pill mills or drug dealers are.
 
Deacfreak07 said:
So how exactly are they different from street level drug pushers?
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Because street-level drug pushers are selling narcotics for recreational use.

Because Big Pharma are selling prescription drugs to treat medical ailments.

Because one is working within the law and one is working outside of the law.
 
Researchers are starting to push marijuana as a treatment for chronic pain. That lobby doesn't have pharma $, though, so they aren't "doing their jobs."
 
It's also where the money in politics compared to common good runs into a huge wall. Supposedly people would be outraged at politicians for this and everything would correct by having these people voted out but you spend enough money you can overcome anything.

So how many deaths can you contribute to Purdue Pharma and OxyContin, 50,000, 100,000? For that they make about 3 billion a year for the low cost of a couple million in lobbying and eventually a 600 million dollar fine. Seems like a win for them. Meanwhile we spend hundreds of billions to prevent a few deaths by Islamic terrorists. America Fuck Yeah!!!
 
ThinkingWithMyDeac said:
Well fast food would need to be straight up lying to you and telling you the food you were eating wasn't bad for you, then you would also become chemically dependent on the fast food, you also wouldn't know any better and would need to just trust the fast food worker to give you what they think is best, then finally you would need to eat like 5 hamburgers because you were given that many.
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Nope.

Big Pharma isn't prescribing me my medicine. Big Pharma is manufacturing it and promoting it. The FDA is in charge of approving new medicines and allowing them into the market. My doctor is prescribing it to me, and the pharmacy is selling it.

The only time the blame should be on Big Pharma is when they falsify their research. Otherwise, the blame falls on the FDA, my doctor or my pharmacy (or those who are charged with oversight of them).

Again, you are blaming the wrong person.
 
Demonbeck said:
Nope.

Big Pharma isn't prescribing me my medicine. Big Pharma is manufacturing it and promoting it. The FDA is in charge of approving new medicines and allowing them into the market. My doctor is prescribing it to me, and the pharmacy is selling it.

The only time the blame should be on Big Pharma is when they falsify their research. Otherwise, the blame falls on the FDA, my doctor or my pharmacy (or those who are charged with oversight of them).

Again, you are blaming the wrong person.
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lol ok

assuming you're a small govt libertarian or conservative type (which idk why i would), you should know the people that "aren't doing their jobs" are republican congressmen with pharma in their pockets by yer own logic then
 
It's also like don't blame me I bribed everyone to look the other way, it's their fault for looking the other way not me for doing what I'm doing.
 
TownieDeac said:
lol ok

assuming you're a small govt libertarian or conservative type (which idk why i would), you should know the people that "aren't doing their jobs" are congressmen with pharma in their pockets by yer own logic then
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Both parties receive money from Big Pharma. Don't pretend it's just those on the right.

I am just saying that your anger is misplaced. Don't fight Big Pharma, you'll never win. Demand better oversight (note that I didn't say more regulations) from your state and federal governments for prescription abuse.
 
ThinkingWithMyDeac said:
It's also like don't blame me I bribed everyone to look the other way, it's their fault for looking the other way not me for doing what I'm doing.
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Not a bribe, bribes are illegal. Political donations are not.

Looking at your avatar, was that the result of big Pharma, a pill mill doctor willing to provide a celebrity client with whatever she wants or a street-level drug pusher? I would put my money on the latter two options.
 
Demonbeck said:
Both parties receive money from Big Pharma. Don't pretend it's just those on the right.

I am just saying that your anger is misplaced. Don't fight Big Pharma, you'll never win. Demand better oversight (note that I didn't say more regulations) from your state and federal governments for prescription abuse.
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Certainly true that both parties take pharma money. Hillary is the worst. That wasn't my point. Conservatives vote not to fund legislation that addresses this oversight.

And you're just willfully ignoring the fact that pharma is quite directly funding measures to stop that oversight. My "demand" is dwarfed by their lobby. And this is why money buying influence in politics is a dangerous game.
 
Yeah this seems to be the same fucking argument for everything, personal responsibility. Lets try it out again but this time it's lots of white middle class and upper middle class people dying. I look forward to the same failed policies.

If you say you want oversight then look at what pharmaceutical companies do to push lack of oversight. It's not even regulation ,the republican boogeyman, it's actually data collection and analysis. Funding for that doesn't exist or gets cut because it's lobbied out by the people that it would oversee.
 
TownieDeac said:
Certainly true that both parties take pharma money. Hillary is the worst. That wasn't my point. Conservatives vote not to fund legislation that addresses this oversight.

And you're just willfully ignoring the fact that pharma is quite directly funding measures to stop that oversight. My "demand" is dwarfed by their lobby. And this is why money buying influence in politics is a dangerous game.
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I don't know how the votes are going down, because this issue isn't one I follow. It would seem to me that conservatives would support the idea of better oversight, but bristle at any suggestion of more regulation/government. Just like liberals are all for more regulation of the pharmaceutical companies and less regulation of marijuana. It's all in how you sell it.

I don't blame these companies for working to maximize profit - that's what companies are supposed to do. (And don't forget, these companies do a lot of good, and employ a lot of people, and pay a lot of taxes.) As long as they are abiding by the law, they are fine by me. Where I think you will get the most traction is in the funding of those oversight programs (at the state and federal level.) If WV's prescription oversight program isn't effective, for instance, then that's where you attack the issue.
 
A better comparison than fast food is tobacco. Tobacco producers aren't the evil ones, the gubmint is!
 
Demonbeck said:
I don't blame these companies for working to maximize profit - that's what companies are supposed to do. (And don't forget, these companies do a lot of good, and employ a lot of people, and pay a lot of taxes.) As long as they are abiding by the law, they are fine by me. Where I think you will get the most traction is in the funding of those oversight programs (at the state and federal level.) If WV's prescription oversight program isn't effective, for instance, then that's where you attack the issue.
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Well if you do at some point feel like following votes, let's see how much money gets allocated for this law, which is actually excellent - http://www.cadca.org/comprehensive-addiction-and-recovery-act-cara

While it authorizes over $181 million each year in new funding to fight the opioid epidemic, monies must be appropriated every year, through the regular appropriations process, in order for it to be distributed in accordance with the law. Guess who just got appointed to lead OMB? A guy who says the govt shouldn't oversee pharma or fund basic research!
 
ThinkingWithMyDeac said:
Yeah this seems to be the same fucking argument for everything, personal responsibility. Lets try it out again but this time it's lots of white middle class and upper middle class people dying. I look forward to the same failed policies.

If you say you want oversight then look at what pharmaceutical companies do to push lack of oversight. It's not even regulation ,the republican boogeyman, it's actually data collection and analysis. Funding for that doesn't exist or gets cut because it's lobbied out by the people that it would oversee.
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Your best opportunity for success is to attack it at the state level. That is where you can affect change the quickest. Correlate the results of state level successes with oversight improvement and then you can build a case for federal funding/improvement.
 
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