America's White People Are In Deep Shit

[ThinkingWithMyDeac]

Is this a real quote? What about the smallpox vaccine?

Yeah from a book called House on Fire about the smallpox eradication effort. Original vaccination protocols were to vaccinate everyone within a geographical location, or in the metaphor put water on houses that aren't on fire. The problem was that supplies were limited so to accomplish goals the protocol changed to identifying areas of need and vaccinate the nearest susceptible people. They chased case after case around the globe until no more cases were left.

It formed the guiding principle of public health now that you go to where problems are before they become bigger problems. A point that is severely missed by politicians. During the smallpox eradication efforts 4 billion people couldn't receive the vaccine, instead areas that were susceptible, reported cases, etc.. were targeted (throwing water on the actual fire). This idea works for most disease and the reason why CDC shifted towards a much larger global presence. If you target the fire you save money, resources and time.

For example when an Ebola vaccine is developed people would clamor for it to be routinely available in the United States, an absolute waste in money resources and time. Instead deploying the vaccine to Western Africa, more specifically cities in Western Africa would be cheaper and all but guarantee that Ebola never makes it to the United States.

 

[PhDeac]

OK. The house metaphor suggests treating individuals without understanding that it's a public health problem.

Addressing drug use in communities with high drug use makes sense.

 

[TownieDeac]

OK. The house metaphor suggests treating individuals without understanding that it's a public health problem.

Addressing drug use in communities with high drug use makes sense.

Or for that matter treating opioid abuse like an epidemic, rather than say "We need to declare a war on drugs."

 

[PhDeac]

Or for that matter treating opioid abuse like an epidemic, rather than say "We need to declare a war on drugs."

I think "war on drugs" is how some people talk about epidemics. They don't know how to frame it differently.

 

[ThinkingWithMyDeac]

Yeah the house is more a metaphor for the direct communities a problem is occurring in while the other houses are the other communities. Like with opioids the directing of resources needs to go to Appalachia the most. Start there and spread out.

I'm still waiting for some conservatives to chime in with their ideas that are also supported by the politicians that represent them. So far we have doubling down on the war on drugs, so some more fail on fail.

 

[PhDeac]

Well we know they're not going to go all broken windows on white rural America.

But they're not going to address the drug companies either.

 

[Strickland33]

Yeah the house is more a metaphor for the direct communities a problem is occurring in while the other houses are the other communities. Like with opioids the directing of resources needs to go to Appalachia the most. Start there and spread out.

I'm still waiting for some conservatives to chime in with their ideas that are also supported by the politicians that represent them. So far we have doubling down on the war on drugs, so some more fail on fail.

To be fair, Catamount wanted to have that discussion. He just hasn't had a single conservative poster contribute productively to the conversation. Lots of Dems from a variety of positions on the left spectrum, though.

 

[sailordeac]

What's your take? Do you think only the "white establishment" should be in power or that people of all races should have access to power?

I've always liked the electoral college, I still do, and plan to support it in the future. I don't like to view everything through the prism of race. I think it produces a narrow and distorted view. The competence of people in power is much more important than their race.

 

[myDeaconmyhand]

Well we know they're not going to go all broken windows on white rural America.

But they're not going to address the drug companies either.

As someone who has surely driven through South Georgia and Northern Florida plenty of times, I know you realize how much more difficult it would be to implement "broken window" policing in rural counties where there are only a few people living every square mile, and there are only like 20 officers in a county.

 

[TownieDeac]

I think "war on drugs" is how some people talk about epidemics. They don't know how to frame it differently.

I mean the guy in the vid I posted (a Dem btw) was saying it's not an opioid problem, it's a weed problem. He said weed is the gateway drug to prescription drugs and then heroin rather than prescription drugs being the problem.

 

[PhDeac]

As someone who has surely driven through South Georgia and Northern Florida plenty of times, I know you realize how much more difficult it would be to implement "broken window" policing in rural counties where there are only a few people living every square mile, and there are only like 20 officers in a county.

Right. Which is one reason why I said they wouldn't do it.

sailor, so you don't agree with O'Reilly or you do? Seems like fighting the white establishment to be sure that "The competence of people in power is much more important than their race" is a worthy objective.

 

[ThinkingWithMyDeac]

Other solutions to go a long with my previous suggestions. Metabolic testing to go along with any pain medication prescription, this should probably be thrown in with routine physicals anyways. The formation of a regulatory body (oh no!!!) located at the CDC or FDA to oversee data collection on individual hospitals as well as individual doctor prescriptions, all the data is there and it's now time to match the data to solutions. In areas of abuse or discrepancies compared to the average,form task forces to investigate and come up with a punitive solution, this should also probably apply to antibiotics. If you are more the incentive person, have lower opioid prescriptions be hospital wide or doctor specific lead to larger Medicare/Medicaid reimbursement. Tie the loss of medical licensing to payments and gifting from pharmaceutical companies, it's already been done in research time to apply to the MD side and not just the PhD side. For those already afflicted create a nationwide detox program, to break addiction it's easier to ease down. Start with decreasing dosing of safe and pure opioids until return to zero, this program is for first timers only.

 

[PhDeac]

Thinking, you should definitely listen to today's Diane Rehm on this. I only heard maybe 15 minutes total in the car but a lot of solutions were discussed from the medical and social perspectives.

Dumb question, but there are dumb people out there. Do some believe people can't get addicted to legal prescription drugs? Makes no sense to focus on weed when prescription drugs are doing such obvious damage.

 

[Deacfreak07]

Thinking, you should definitely listen to today's Diane Rehm on this. I only heard maybe 15 minutes total in the car but a lot of solutions were discussed from the medical and social perspectives.

Dumb question, but there are dumb people out there. Do some believe people can't get addicted to legal prescription drugs? Makes no sense to focus on weed when prescription drugs are doing such obvious damage.

The local yo boys ain't funding nobody's campaigns.

 

[Demonbeck]

This is incredibly naive. Big Pharms isn't just protecting their interests--they actively introduced legislation that made it harder for regulators to stop pharmacies that are dispensing disproportionately large numbers of opioids. Congress is utterly beholden to the industry on this front. They've sided with industry on regulations that would limit docs prescribing opioids, they sided with industry on not allowing Medicare/Medicaid to negotiate lower drug prices. The state of West Virginia has sued pharmaceutical manufacturers, but Congress passed laws protecting them from litigation. The CDC has suggested the public health epidemic should be addressed at the level of docs, and issued guidelines to that end, but the Interagency Pain Research Coordinating Committee (IPRCC), more or less neutered the guidelines. Big Pharma is tying the hands of regulators by getting in the pockets of Congress. And surprise, surprise, it's hyper-partisan. The CARA, legislation meant specifically to address this epidemic, was passed by both houses but not funded, and guess who led the charge?

Senator Orrin Hatch, chairman of the finance committee, who took $360,000 from industry, and Representative Mike Rogers, who received more than $300,000. They wrote the legislation that established the IPRCC mentioned above. Hooray!

But let's not scrutinize Big Pharma!

So the problem is Big Pharma, or Congress, because the way you describe it, it sounds to me like one is doing a good job and the other isn't.

 

[Demonbeck]

To be clear, you're essentially saying that it's not Big Pharma's responsibility to internalize the costs of selling their product because there are already governmental agencies who try to do that.

I am saying that Big Pharma consists of for-profit companies who create products that have a nearly infinite demand. These for-profit companies have been very successful in protecting and promoting their industry. It is not incumbent upon them to enforce the laws of the land. That is the role of government.

 

[TownieDeac]

So the problem is Big Pharma, or Congress, because the way you describe it, it sounds to me like one is doing a good job and the other isn't.

I am saying that Big Pharma consists of for-profit companies who create products that have a nearly infinite demand. These for-profit companies have been very successful in protecting and promoting their industry. It is not incumbent upon them to enforce the laws of the land. That is the role of government.

ha ok

 

[Demonbeck]

You don't think food producers share some blame in the obesity epidemic? I don't think these are nefarious actors. Just people trying to make as much money as possible. I don't expect ethics or morality to come into play with those decisions. Purely profit. The free market is not, nor has it ever been, a moralistic force. That's not its job.

Nope. I am fat because I eat too much and don't work out enough. I am too lazy to cook a healthy meal far too often. It is most certainly not Chick-Fil-A's fault.

 

[ThinkingWithMyDeac]

Your fast food analogies don't work at all so I don't know why you keep using them.

 

[Demonbeck]

Your fast food analogies don't work at all so I don't know why you keep using them.

What don't you understand about what I said?