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James Johnson getting paid

Man I'd put McKie on that team simply as payment for suffering through those years.
 
Is he playing professionally anywhere?
 
The number one NBA draft pick in 1995 belonged to Golden State. The GM for Golden State was Don Nelson. Nelson stated that Tim Duncan would be the Warriors pick if he declared for the draft. He also added something to the effect that as far as the NBA draft was concerned it would be Tim Duncan as #1 until he was actually drafted. Nobody in the NBA ever challenged that statement.

An all time Deacon team is not an all time Deacon team if Charlie Davis is not included.
 
PhDeac said:
Collins and Chaundee are already on my team. If Howard was healthy enough to play, he would.
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Is he not healthy enough to play basketball at the moment? If we are fielding this team for a 7 game series I'm probably taking J-Ho over McKie. If it's for an 82 game season give me McKie.
 
aceeight said:
I doubt he would have been #1 after his Soph. or jr year. Both were very strong drafts.
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RChildress107 said:
Is he not healthy enough to play basketball at the moment? If we are fielding this team for a 7 game series I'm probably taking J-Ho over McKie. If it's for an 82 game season give me McKie.
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Howard is 37 and hasn't played since he was 34. He tried to make several comebacks that got cut down by injury. If he could play, he would play.
 
PhDeac said:
Howard is 37 and hasn't played since he was 34. He tried to make several comebacks that got cut down by injury. If he could play, he would play.
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What the fuck are you talking about. Plenty of guys retire from professional basketball because they are old and tired, not because they literally can't play the game anymore. Just because he isn't trecking out to Lebanon to find a League he can hang in doesn't mean "he can't play."

Using that logic why include Tim on the team?
 
EatLeadCommie said:
Both Rodney and Darius had more offensive polish than Tim coming into Wake. By the time they all left, Tim was clearly above them both and had been since his junior year.
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RJKarl said:
Tim was the best player in the country during his soph year. Jerry West said Tim would have been the clear #1 pick after his soph year.
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No, he wasn't. He wasn't even the best player in his conference (Joe Smith says hello). IIRC, he was generally regarded as the 3rd best big man in the ACC behind Smith and Wallace. Scouts were intrigued by his abilities and potential, though, considering his lack of experience and how quickly he had taken to the game. It was clear he was going to be a superstar if he stayed healthy. What I said was Tim clearly surpassed RR and DS at some point in his junior year when he was duking it out for POY with Camby. You could make the case that he surpassed DS at some point during his sophomore year, but not RR.
 
RChildress107 said:
What the fuck are you talking about. Plenty of guys retire from professional basketball because they are old and tired, not because they literally can't play the game anymore. Just because he isn't trecking out to Lebanon to find a League he can hang in doesn't mean "he can't play."

Using that logic why include Tim on the team?
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Because Tim could still play one year ago. And two years ago, he was still one of the best players in the game. On my roster, he could play 15-20 minutes at C before giving way to a small lineup with Collins at C and Johnson at PF.
 
EatLeadCommie said:
No, he wasn't. He wasn't even the best player in his conference (Joe Smith says hello). IIRC, he was generally regarded as the 3rd best big man in the ACC behind Smith and Wallace. Scouts were intrigued by his abilities and potential, though, considering his lack of experience and how quickly he had taken to the game. It was clear he was going to be a superstar if he stayed healthy. What I said was Tim clearly surpassed RR and DS at some point in his junior year when he was duking it out for POY with Camby. You could make the case that he surpassed DS at some point during his sophomore year, but not RR.
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My recollection is different.

Joe Smith and Rasheed Wallace were both solid NBA prospects when they came out (and were more developed players as sophomores), but Tim Duncan was considered a franchise changing player as early as his sophomore year. Duncan was young for his class (enrolled at WF at 17), and comparatively had played very little basketball. He was improving by leaps and bounds almost on monthly basis. It was well known in the professional basketball world by the end of his sophomore year that the most coveted player of his generation was Tim Duncan. While you never can get an universal agreement on anything, the strong consensus was that Tim Duncan would've been picked ahead of Joe Smith and Wallace in 1995, and Duncan would've been the first pick in 1995 or 1996 had he entered the draft.
 
RChildress107 said:
What the fuck are you talking about. Plenty of guys retire from professional basketball because they are old and tired, not because they literally can't play the game anymore. Just because he isn't trecking out to Lebanon to find a League he can hang in doesn't mean "he can't play."

Using that logic why include Tim on the team?
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PhDeac said:
Because Tim could still play one year ago. And two years ago, he was still one of the best players in the game. On my roster, he could play 15-20 minutes at C before giving way to a small lineup with Collins at C and Johnson at PF.
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This may be the new gold standard for hypothetical team arguments. We've evolved beyond the 2005 vs 1997 or whatever arguments. Now we've got a new hypothetical league and we're bringing in old dudes off the street in their current condition. We've officially run out of good sprots discussions. It was a good run.
 
PhDeac said:
Because Tim could still play one year ago. And two years ago, he was still one of the best players in the game. On my roster, he could play 15-20 minutes at C before giving way to a small lineup with Collins at C and Johnson at PF.
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I don't know man, if Tim could play he would play. Better switch him out for David Weaver.
 
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http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/sports/nba-eyes-duncan-article-1.680044

IT HASN'T taken Tim Duncan, Wake Forest's prodigy, long to catch the attention of NBA scouts and general managers. No less an authority than Lakers GM Jerry West has called Duncan, a 6-10, 238-pound sophomore, the best player in the country and a No. 1 pick in the draft . . . if he leaves school after this season.

This is not to say that Tim Duncan, sophomore, was a better offensive player than Rodney Rogers was as a sophomore. Rodney Rogers was, offensively, a stud as a sophomore and Duncan clearly was a more highly regarded defensive player than he was for his offense.
 
Have you guys watched the Big3? Quality of play falls of dramatically once they retire. Even former all-stars look like a joke.
 
Duncan was good offensively as a sophomore. What made Duncan the #1 player as a sophomore was a realization that he was a once in a lifetime defender and rebounder combined with being a very good offensive player.
 
ChrisL68 said:
Duncan was good offensively as a sophomore. What made Duncan the #1 player as a sophomore was a realization that he was a once in a lifetime defender and rebounder combined with being a very good offensive player.
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Duncan was good offensively as a sophomore

Rogers was probably better offensively as a sophomore

Duncan averaged just under 17 PPG on 59% shooting with 67 assists and 91 turnovers

Rogers averaged 20.5 PPG on 61% shooting with 81 assists and 69 turnovers
 
Pilchard said:
My recollection is different.

Joe Smith and Rasheed Wallace were both solid NBA prospects when they came out (and were more developed players as sophomores), but Tim Duncan was considered a franchise changing player as early as his sophomore year. Duncan was young for his class (enrolled at WF at 17), and comparatively had played very little basketball. He was improving by leaps and bounds almost on monthly basis. It was well known in the professional basketball world by the end of his sophomore year that the most coveted player of his generation was Tim Duncan. While you never can get an universal agreement on anything, the strong consensus was that Tim Duncan would've been picked ahead of Joe Smith and Wallace in 1995, and Duncan would've been the first pick in 1995 or 1996 had he entered the draft.
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My recollection is identical to yours. Nobody is arguing that Tim wouldn't have been take #1. The only point I'm making is that he was still very much a project and that RR had a more polished offensive game until Duncan was a junior. I think DS did too, but that's more debatable. Obviously, Duncan was leaps and bounds ahead of both defensively and in the rebounding department.

AS FRESHMEN (offensive game)
RR > DS > TD

AS SOPHOMORES (offensive game)
RR > DS > TD

AS JUNIORS (offensive game)
TD > RR > DS

That's all I said. Nothing too terribly controversial, really. This has all made me realize how much I miss Darius's game.
 
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