Justin Gray ('06) Named Head Coach at Coastal Carolina

[DeacDaddy]

Based on what? We’ve made ONE Final Four in our history. We’re no more of a bball school than a football school.

You know as well as I do, based on Tim Duncan and Chris Paul. Never mind Childress, Rogers, and Muggsy.

Perception is reality, and if you meet a stranger on the street, that’s what they are most likely to know & bring up about Wake Forest athletics.

 

[skinnydeac]

I just googled which schools are in the Big East. Sounds so so exciting.

 

[deacdixieboy]

You know as well as I do, based on Tim Duncan and Chris Paul. Never mind Childress, Rogers, and Muggsy.

Perception is reality, and if you meet a stranger on the street, that’s what they are most likely to know & bring up about Wake Forest athletics.

Maybe. Depends on their age. Those people were all 20+ years ago now. I interact with college students daily. All they know is that we blow in bball but have been top 10 in football.

 

[DeacDaddy]

Maybe. Depends on their age. Those people were all 20+ years ago now. I interact with college students daily. All they know is that we blow in bball but have been top 10 in football.

I’ll take your word for it regarding your anecdotal interactions. I find it hard to believe that nationwide, even people of that generation are more aware that we’ve been top ten in football, as opposed to associating us with our all-time great Hall of Fame basketball players, one of whom is still playing.

 

[deacdixieboy]

I’ll take your word for it regarding your anecdotal interactions. I find it hard to believe that nationwide, even people of that generation are more aware that we’ve been top ten in football, as opposed to associating us with our all-time great Hall of Fame basketball players, one of whom is still playing.

Many people don’t have any idea where NBA players went to college.

 

[donaldross]

Back to the topic since there are some J. Gray haters above.

This is Justin's second season at Western. They were horrific before he arrived. In fact, they finished dead last in the So Con. Last year (Justin's first), they shot all the way to 4th and then made a run to the Conference Finals. I was shocked by how well Justin's team performed.

Justin has had another promising start here in his second season including a Win at Vandy. They are 8-5 in this 1 bid league. The season is hardly off the rails. Samford is the best team clearly but you never know.

The Southern Conference is definitely the cradle of Coaches. Just 4 years ago you had Mike Young, Lamont Paris, Forbes, and Wes. There are excellent Coaches again in that league. Justin is way overachieving. We will see if he can crack through in March. Ultimately, you have to make the dance to get the next job (which all 4 above did). Of course, Wake Forest just seems to hire whomever won that particular season (which they did with Forbes, rather than think about the long game). If we really like Justin after next season, why wait? Someone else will hire him if we do not. Again, I much prefer Kelsey but the reality is he (like Wes) is probably off the table at this point. We need to get "the guy" before he becomes "the guy" or we will be recycling the same old 55 year old hires every 5-6 years for eternity. That plan has not worked.

 

[DeaconSig]

In this thread, we find out that DR is ForbesOUT.

 

[DeacDaddy]

Many people don’t have any idea where NBA players went to college.

But many do. And many, many more don’t have a clue that Wake Forest was in the top 10 in college football for like a week. I can’t really see how this is even an argument.

We’ve made our points. We can agree that this would be a non issue if we just achieved Top 10 in both!

 

[deacdixieboy]

But many do. And many, many more don’t have a clue that Wake Forest was in the top 10 in college football for like a week. I can’t really see how this is even an argument.

We’ve made our points. We can agree that this would be a non issue if we just achieved Top 10 in both!

Let’s do that!

 

[Pilchard]

Two years and three months ago, WF had the ball down 3 to Pitt with 2:07 left in the third quarter. Sam Hartman then threw a pick. If WF wins that game, and the game was very winnable, WF wins the ACC. In the current CFP structure, WF would have qualifed for the 12 team football playoff.

Heading into the 2022 ACC Football season, WF was among the top 4 teams predicted to win the ACC. After week 8 of that season, WF was tied with USC at #10 in the AP poll. At that point in the season, WF was 6-1, and was favored in every remaining game of that season. WF one loss was in OT to Clemson - a game that WF has several opportunities to win. Clemson won the ACC and would have made the CFP under the new format. Realize that the 2023 season was mega-bad, but geez, the recency bias to claim that WF cannot compete in football is simply wrong, and was proven wrong in two of the three most recent college football seasons. The self-loathing here is sad.

 

[donaldross]

But many do. And many, many more don’t have a clue that Wake Forest was in the top 10 in college football for like a week. I can’t really see how this is even an argument.

We’ve made our points. We can agree that this would be a non issue if we just achieved Top 10 in both!

Actually, we don't agree on that. Some of us have the position that by not choosing a couple nonfootball sports and specializing, we are doomed to fail over the long haul. I'm sure that's the minority position--since it's mine.

 

[deacfan123]

All of that good stuff was Pre NIL. We are in a different ERA now. And we were not close to being a contender even in the 2021 season. 2022 we were farther off even though we had a good ranking. We sucked after that, plain and simple.

We have a much better chance in basketball than in football, it's pretty obvious.

 

[Colonel Angus]

Definitely just my opinion and could be off-base, but if it was fan-driven at Wake for folks who give, I would guess that weighs heavily towards the "want this to go to basketball over football if given the choice".

RTQ allows for the flexibility to direct contributions to individual sports.

Those who want 100% of their donation to support only men's basketball certainly have that option.

Personally I split my monthly NIL contribution 50/50 between football and men's basketball. Even though Wake will never be a "football school" with 30,000 undergrads or a 70,000 seat stadium, I see value in having a relevant football program that's a constant pain in the ass to the "football schools" in the ACC and around the country.

 

[Pilchard]

All of that good stuff was Pre NIL. We are in a different ERA now. And we were not close to being a contender even in the 2021 season. 2022 we were farther off even though we had a good ranking. We sucked after that, plain and simple.

We have a much better chance in basketball than in football, it's pretty obvious.

Wow. One season sample and suddenly WF can't compete because of NIL. Duke football is not an NIL bastion (they just lost their QB to ND - sound familiar?), and until Riley Leonard went down in mid-season, Duke was in line to play in the ACCCG. BTW, Duke led FSU in Tallahasse in the third quarter, until Leonhard went down with an ankle injury. WF football struggled in 2023, not because of NIL, but because the staff massively over-rated the QB.

 

[donaldross]

You are 100% correct that this whole thing is now donor choice -- it really was the whole time but certainly now.

The performance on the playing fields and courts is very much our choice. The results you are seeing now is a direct result of our alum's overwhelming decision not to choose Men's Basketball.

 

[Deacfreak07]

If y'all don't think the gulf in revenue between the two football conferences and everyone else is going to show up in MBB NIL, then it's not really worth a conversation. Eventually schools will be paying players directly, and the schools getting the best hoops talent will almost certainly be those with the most football revenue with very few exceptions.

 

[deacfan123]

Wow. One season sample and suddenly WF can't compete because of NIL. Duke football is not an NIL bastion (they just lost their QB to ND - sound familiar?), and until Riley Leonard went down in mid-season, Duke was in line to play in the ACCCG. BTW, Duke led FSU in Tallahasse in the third quarter, until Leonhard went down with an ankle injury. WF football struggled in 2023, not because of NIL, but because the staff massively over-rated the QB.

We'll see how it turns out. I have serious doubts that we can retain enough talent, and be 40-50 players deep in football to compete with the big boys. I do not doubt that we can get enough to be 6-8 deep with 2/3 players making a huge difference in bball.

 

[DeacDaddy]

Let’s do that!

I mean, it is doable

 

[mercurydime]

We’re no more of a bball school than a football school.

There's some recency bias in your assessment, it seems. Wake Forest has spent a total of 274 weeks ranked in the AP poll.

Over time, we're most likely better known for our basketball...good or bad.

I'm decades in here. Not going to argue, though. You're certainly entitled to your opinion.

 

[Deacfreak07]

Vanderbilt has a better chance to be good than Davidson year in and year out is the comparison you want to make.