• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

Stay John Collins!

bobknightfan said:
And the trash can story involved an LSU fan after a regional game in the NCAAT. It didn't have anything to do with the police officer in Puerto Rico. That alone shows that this guy 1) doesn't have any idea what he is talking about, and 2) is completely unconcerned about the accuracy of what he writes in his columns. (Which is pretty much par for the course among Knight critics.)

Bob Knight has more integrity than all of his bastard critics combined.
Click to expand...


Lol. Bob Knight is a total piece of shit and so are you for defending him.
 
Why is BKF constantly allowed to derail every thread he takes part in? Not every fucking thread is about Bob Knight, it's getting ridiculous. Mods?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
warak said:
agreed, Knight has always been a lime-ball that IU covered up his abuse until they rightly fired him. I can't imagine the abuse growing up with Knight as your father...or husband.
Click to expand...

Shades of The Great Santini
 
wolfdeac said:
Why is BKF constantly allowed to derail every thread he takes part in? Not every fucking thread is about Bob Knight, it's getting ridiculous. Mods?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

If you will notice, in most of those threads I am not the one who injects Bob Knight into the thread. I will make a post about something that another poster disagrees with and that poster feels obligated to bring up Bob Knight in a response to me. For some reason, many times when I make a post, somebody feels that is a bell ringing for them to make a response blasting Bob Knight. And...most of the time....when some ignorant ass makes a bullshit comment about Coach Knight, I am going to defend him.
 
Last edited:
I am just looking at this from a financial point of view. I was just looking at some NBA Mock Drafts from CBS (26th), NBAdraftnet (22nd), Draftexpress (15th), Tankaton (14th), Landof10 (23rd), which have all been updated within the last 2-3 days and he is currently projected between 14th-26th. Basically, he is at best a late Lottery Pick or a mid/late 1st round pick. The reason I am bringing this up is because an NBA Player's salary is "basically" set for their first 4 seasons (I know only the first 2 years are guaranteed, and team options could occur in their 3rd and 4th season, but I want to keep the math "simple"). Personally, I believe that if Collins stays another season and works on his defense, then he has a very very good chance to be a Top 10 Pick if not higher, and would dramatically increase the amount of money he would make in his first 4 NBA Seasons. Below, I used the salaries for the 2017 NBA Draft class from http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/info/rookie_scale/2017 to show financially what Collins would receive if he is picked were is currently projected, then I showed what some of the other slots would make in this years draft, and then compared them to what he could make if waited 1 more season to work on his game to become a possible Top 10 Pick. I only used the first years since they are the only ones that are guaranteed.


2017 Draft
Year 1 Year 2 Total
26th $1.21 $1.45 $2.66
23rd $1.37 $1.62 $2.99
20th $1.54 $1.83 $3.37
15th $1.97 $2.33 $4.30
14th $2.07 $2.46 $4.53
--------------------------
10th $2.54 $3.02 $5.56
8th $2.99 $3.46 $6.45
6th $3.48 $4.14 $7.62

2018 Draft
14th $2.37 $2.77 $5.14
12th $2.65 $3.07 $5.72
10th $2.98 $3.40 $6.38
8th $3.31 $3.90 $7.21
6th $3.98 $4.66 $8.64
4th $4.82 $5.67 $10.49

If Collins was picked in this year's NBA Draft as currently projected between 26th-14th, then his salary range for his first two seasons would be between $2.66 to $4.53. On the other hand, if he waited 1 more season and developed into a Top 10 pick, then he could be looking at $6.38 to $10.49. This is a difference of $3.72-$5.96 in just his first two seasons. The problem is that the current NBA Rookie Contract is "set" for 4 seasons, and if we could just agree to use the simplest form for his 3rd and 4th season, then those numbers would double to $7.44-$11.92.
 
That math ignores that he will reach free agency one year earlier, and have one less year of NBA earning potential. He can easily make up for a lower rookie scale contract by having another year of free agency money. The bottomline is that if he is projected to go in the mid-late first round, he will be leaving millions of dollars on the table by staying in college for another year. I know nothing about Collins' family situation, but passing on that because he might make 8 million his first two years in the league instead of 4 million, is a huge, huge risk for anyone who is not already very wealthy. No brainer to go if he is told he will be taken in the first round.
 
That math ignores that he would have another year to earn a better 2nd contract.
 
PhDeac said:
That math ignores that he would have another year to earn a better 2nd contract.
Click to expand...

First, I am addressing not just PhDeac but KitchinDeac comments as well.

Yeah, 4 years after his rookie deal, then he can start making the big $$$$. Plus you have to assume that he makes it in the NBA to deserve a big deal on his 2nd contract. Look at Johnson and Teague who were drafted the same year 16th and 19th. Both could have benefited from staying at least another season. Now, Johnson is a bust and only making $2.5 million the next few seasons which is less than what a lottery pick makes; where as, Teague is decent starter, made 1 All-Star Game, and is now making $8 million a season. What happens if Collins is bust similar to Johnson (I hope he doesn't)? Then that extra $6-$10 million from his rookie deal becomes much more attractive.

If you were referring to the 3rd & 4th year team options, then that can go as high as 120% to the base salary in his draft slot. Kyrie Irving only made a little over $7 million in his 4th year in the league after the team option was picked up for the 2014-2015 season, and he was the #1 overall pick. http://www.spotrac.com/nba/cleveland-cavaliers/kyrie-irving-8051/cash-earnings/

My point was only to show how much money Collins would make if he was drafted in the 14-26 range this year compared to what he could possibly make if he stayed 1 more year, improved his draft stock, and was drafted next year in the 4-14 range because the dollar amount of NBA Rookie Contracts are already predetermined according to the draft pick. I wasn't trying to get into debates about hypothetical situations that could occur to him once he is in the NBA.
 
JJ is making 4mm this year and is about to get paid.
 
How is Johnson a bust? He was drafted #16 in a very good draft and is in his 8th NBA season.
 
PhDeac said:
How is Johnson a bust? He was drafted #16 in a very good draft and is in his 8th NBA season.
Click to expand...

Johnson has barely hit the $17 Million mark in his 8 NBA seasons and is only averaging 12 and 5 this year.

Bust city. Collins shouldn't even bother play professional basketball in any form if he's just going to fail like James Johnson has.
 
DCDeac said:
Johnson has barely hit the $17 Million mark in his 8 NBA seasons and is only averaging 12 and 5 this year.

Bust city. Collins shouldn't even bother play professional basketball in any form if he's just going to fail like James Johnson has.
Click to expand...

Lol what? Come on man, journeyman or not I would not call someone who has managed to stay in the league and contribute for 8 straight seasons out of college a failure.
 
zqglass said:
Lol what? Come on man, journeyman or not I would not call someone who has managed to stay in the league and contribute for 8 straight seasons out of college a failure.
Click to expand...

I think there is a difference between an NBA Journeyman and a "Failure". IMO, a NBA Journeyman is someone who can hang around in the NBA for 8-15 years; whereas, an NBA "Failure" is someone who is out of the NBA within a 3-5 year window, some players don't even make it 3 seasons.

As for Johnson, someone said he is making $4 million this season and you are correct. He made $2.5 million in each of the previous 2 seasons (15-16 & 14-15), and roughly $650,000 during the 13-14 NBA Season.
 
Last edited:
zqglass said:
Woops, quick to the trigger there.
Click to expand...

Yeah, sorry, sarcasm.

Interesting fact - being from Cheyenne, James Johnson is the highest paid Wyoming athlete.

Also his listed nickname is Bloodsport.

Anyway, all these arguments are asinine. Unless he drops off the map for some reason it would be borderline criminal negligence for Collins to come back to Wake. I also doubt he watches 50+ points walk by him in our last 2 games of the year if he didn't have the NBA (and the disaster an injury would be) running around in his head.

Manning will figure it out next year, we have plenty of talent coming in. Just the experience of making the tourney this year is huge for this team compared to where they were the previous season. And considering who our coach is, I'd much rather have a gap to fill at the 5 than any other position.
 
Speaking of JJ does anyone ever catch him on LeBatard's radio show? He's on there all the time, and he definitely doesn't sound like he paid very much attention to his studies at MSD.
 
Last edited:
Unless something totally freakish happens, it's highly unlikely that John would get into the Top 5 next year. Thus the extra year would most likely more than make up for his slight rise in the draft.

Being in the 7-12 range means you are very likely to be a bad franchise. This could hurt his long-term earnings as well.
 
Why does *everything* have to be about money? I agree it's a prime motivator, but we'd all find some agreement in the premise that money can't buy every thing.

I get the potential injury contingency, but is that the norm by which these type situations are consistently judged? Is that the single most important consideration?

Per the discussion here, you'd think so.
 
zqglass said:
Speaking of JJ does enayone ever catch him on LeBatard's radio show? He's on there all the time, and he definitely doesn't sound like he paid very much attention to his studies at MSD.
Click to expand...

They like him on there. I heard a different side to his personality than I ever picked up on at Wake.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top