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WF MBB Game 18: Deacs at BC: Saturday 8 pm: ESPN2

The ACC was fine last year and is good this year. Just because ESPN would rather hype up leagues they’re financially invested in doesn’t mean the ACC is worse.

ACC is meh for a power conference. Nobody right now is really a title contender. Five top 40-50 teams plus a mid tier Wake, Pitt, Clemson and Cuse. Then whatever it is VPI is doing with a drop off for ND, FSU, BC, Tech, and Louisville.
 
You have to be impressed with what Forbes has been able to do this season. I did not think we would be in this position almost halfway through the conference schedule.

Especially given that someone we thought was going to be a key piece - Jao - is not even playing.

This is the second season in a row he has taken a player that already had a lot of experience in college, and is finding another gear (or two) from them. Alondes last season, Appleby this season.

I am concerned that Appleby will run out of gas down the stretch. Alondes seemed to towards the end of last season, and he was playing less minutes. But not sure what else can be done right now if there is no one else on the roster that can give 8-10 mins at guard.
Cam is putting in work to be the guy who enables Appleby to throttle back to around 30 min per game. That already happens some possessions as Cam is the primary ball handler and initiates the offense, allowing Appleby to rest as a spot up shooter.
 
You have to be impressed with what Forbes has been able to do this season. I did not think we would be in this position almost halfway through the conference schedule.

Especially given that someone we thought was going to be a key piece - Jao - is not even playing.

This is the second season in a row he has taken a player that already had a lot of experience in college, and is finding another gear (or two) from them. Alondes last season, Appleby this season.

I am concerned that Appleby will run out of gas down the stretch. Alondes seemed to towards the end of last season, and he was playing less minutes. But not sure what else can be done right now if there is no one else on the roster that can give 8-10 mins at guard.
Alondes was hurt the last five weeks of the season. He was in real pain at Clemson and against BC with turf toe that just wouldn’t go away. That’s why his production and minutes dropped off.
 
ACC is meh for a power conference. Nobody right now is really a title contender. Five top 40-50 teams plus a mid tier Wake, Pitt, Clemson and Cuse. Then whatever it is VPI is doing with a drop off for ND, FSU, BC, Tech, and Louisville.
ACC is better than the B10, probably the same as the Big East, better then the PAC12, and very similar to the SEC. B12 is better but not as good as the computer nerds make it out to be. Last year the ACC had no title contenders and then had two teams make the final four.
 
ACC is better than the B10, probably the same as the Big East, better then the PAC12, and very similar to the SEC. B12 is better but not as good as the computer nerds make it out to be. Last year the ACC had no title contenders and then had two teams make the final four.
So two title contenders.
 
ACC is better than the B10, probably the same as the Big East, better then the PAC12, and very similar to the SEC. B12 is better but not as good as the computer nerds make it out to be. Last year the ACC had no title contenders and then had two teams make the final four.
The Big 12 doesn’t have as many teams which in some years hurts them. This year it helps because they don’t have Louisville, Cal, Oregon State, etc. tanking their whole conference.
 
Last year’s team was
The Big 12 doesn’t have as many teams which in some years hurts them. This year it helps because they don’t have Louisville, Cal, Oregon State, etc. tanking their whole conference.
Yea exactly. Same thing with the Big East, though they do have Georgetown. That league would be a juggernaut if their most famed program wasn’t a complete dumpster fire.
 
I realize there are many factors involved (like winning 20 games, etc) but today, what would you put the odds on the Deacs making the NCAA Tourney?
Just curious.
 
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I’m not going to get into it too much, but on no planet is the ACC a better conference than the Big Ten, no matter how you want to look at it.

The Big 10 has better teams up top, better teams in the middle, and better teams at the bottom. I know we beat them in the Challenge, but that does not at all line up with how good each conference is to this point in the year.
 
I realize there are many factors involved (like winning 20 games, etc) but today, what would you put the odds on the Deacs making the NCAA Tourney.
Just curious.
TORVIK has it at 23.8%, and 5.5% of that is if we win the ACCT. I do think the odds are higher than that almost solely due to the fact that UVA is overrated in the advanced metrics.

If we can go 2-0 this week then we should be around 50%.
 
I’m not going to get into it too much, but on no planet is the ACC a better conference than the Big Ten, no matter how you want to look at it.

The Big 10 has better teams up top, better teams in the middle, and better teams at the bottom. I know we beat them in the Challenge, but that does not at all line up with how good each conference is to this point in the year.
Who is good outside of Purdue? Indiana stinks, Ohio State just lost to last place Minnesota, Michigan State is mediocre (blown out by Notre Dame). They have one ranked team. One. That narrative is lazy.
 
Who is good outside of Purdue? Indiana stinks, Ohio State just lost to last place Minnesota, Michigan State is mediocre (blown out by Notre Dame). They have one ranked team. One. That narrative is lazy.
Illinois and Rutgers are both quite good. I would put Rutgers up against anybody in the ACC.

It’s not just the top though, it’s the depth of the league overall. Minnesota sucks, but other than Nebraska, every single other team is ahead of Wake, and we’re in the middle of the ACC, if not the upper echelon.
 
Illinois and Rutgers are both quite good. I would put Rutgers up against anybody in the ACC.

It’s not just the top though, it’s the depth of the league overall. Minnesota sucks, but other than Nebraska, every single other team is ahead of Wake, and we’re in the middle of the ACC, if not the upper echelon.
Rutgers was handled by Miami without too much trouble, so would hesitate to say they’re better than anyone in the ACC. Also have home losses to a bad Seton Hall team and mediocre Iowa team. They’re similar to UNC imo, probably would be 4th in the ACC.
 
Which leagues is ESPN invested in? The ACC is one of them, no? SEC is ESPN?
 
ACC is better than the B10, probably the same as the Big East, better then the PAC12, and very similar to the SEC. B12 is better but not as good as the computer nerds make it out to be. Last year the ACC had no title contenders and then had two teams make the final four.

Interestingly enough, KP ranks conferences by the AdjEM of a team projected to go .500 in-conference.

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I'll be honest... I've been one of the biggest KenPom fanboys on this board.

... But, I'm falling off of the bandwagon this season.


Let's take a look at the resume of a team projected to go .500 in the 'better than the ACC' Pac 12:


Here's the start of the season for Washington State. Who is ranked #64 in KenPom's system, and projected to go (10-10) in conference play:

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That, my friends, is some grade A bullshit.

... If an average team in the PAC 12 is taking double digit losses to Prairie View A&M (#273) en route to a 6-10 start, I'm not buying into any nonsense that says the PAC 12 is superior to the ACC.

Not to mention the fact that VT (#46), losers of their last 5, including a loss against B.C. (#200), & projected losers of their next 2, is maintaining an AdjEM ~30 spots above WF (#75).

This is all indicative of major flaws in the system, IMO.
 

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Which leagues is ESPN invested in? The ACC is one of them, no? SEC is ESPN?
SEC is their cash cow, which is why they’ll ask Clemson, FSU, and Miami to leave the ACC in 2035 just as FOX asked USC and UCLA to join the B10 this summer. However, the money and influence in the B10 has a huge amount of influence on media and the tournament committee as Forbes and other ACC coaches talked about at the end of last season.
 
What would the ACC be ranked if major conference teams ranked 200+ were excluded? If the ACC wasn’t penalized for BC and FSU?
 
What would the ACC be ranked if major conference teams ranked 200+ were excluded? If the ACC wasn’t penalized for BC and FSU?
It’s also important to note the effect of preseason expectations in metrics such as Kenpom. The teams at the top of the ACC are helped down in that system by low preseason expectations. There are some metrics that don’t weigh preseason such as something called KPI that actually see the ACC quite favorably.
 
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