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BERNIE

Deacsfan27 said:
How about we make community colleges and two-year "craft" schools, and then actually foster people that want to do that in middle school and high school. Not everybody needs/wants/should go to a 4-year school.
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Seems reasonable and a plan to me, there aren't enough of those schools to start and not enough direction towards those types of programs starting in high school. There needs to be a shift away from everyone needs to go to "college" in the way we think about it today and more a shift towards what will suit your skill set. Saying here's a bunch of money in the system we have now won't work, might as well just burn the money. So make a plan, take your free money for everyone plan over the next decade and put into place a change that works then revisit giving said money to individual for education.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
How about we make community colleges and two-year "craft" schools, and then actually foster people that want to do that in middle school and high school. Not everybody needs/wants/should go to a 4-year school.
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Wasn't that pretty much Clinton's initial proposal?
 
bym051d said:
Listening to Donald over Bernie means you were never really with Bernie.
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I tend to agree with Bernie, but not when it comes to everything. Trump might make some good points as well. I need to look at what he's saying.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
How about we make community colleges and two-year "craft" schools, and then actually foster people that want to do that in middle school and high school. Not everybody needs/wants/should go to a 4-year school.
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The counter to that is the government already subsidizes 12 years of "free" education. Why extend it 2 or 4 more years?
 
Deacsfan27 said:
How about we make community colleges and two-year "craft" schools, and then actually foster people that want to do that in middle school and high school. Not everybody needs/wants/should go to a 4-year school.
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California has a three tiered higher public education system. Every county has at least one junior college. If you complete an Associates degree, you can enroll in the Cal State system (San Diego State, San Jose State)-two dozen schools statewide and all but a handful essentially have open enrollment. UC system (a dozen campuses) is competitive for admission. UCs offer PhDs and some CSUs offer master degrees.

If you are going to make public higher education tuition free, it should be set up like the military academies (i.e. some form of offsetting public service aftterward). If you want to avoid public service, take out loans, pay for it yourself, or go to a private school.

At the end of World War II, only 5% of adults have four year degrees. GI Bill helped vets pay for their education. Now 30% of adults have four year degrees. Average adult has one year of college. Santorum (one more advanced degree than Obama) called Obama a snob for trying to get adults additional training and education.

Directly after Frothy's whining, Wall Street Journal's lead front page story was on South Carolina's public education and business partnership to support the auto industry. Clemson, USC Upstate, and a Greenville JC worked directly with auto manufacturers and suppliers.
 
TuffaloDeac10 said:
Because knowledge is good?
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You're implying that opposing this is to oppose knowledge?

How about we just offer subsidized education for as many years as people would like? After all, knowledge is good.

I'm not a "bootstraps" guy, but at a certain point you've been given enough free education and need to obtain more "knowledge" at your own expense instead of at everyone else's.

That said, I think we need to dramatically shift our current education system towards STEM with more rigorous classes and year round schooling.
 
bym051d said:
Listening to Donald over Bernie means you were never really with Bernie.
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Or maybe you just pay more attention to their economic agendas than their social agendas. They share a fair amount economically but are diametrically opposed socially.
 
Liquid Karma said:
You're implying that opposing this is to oppose knowledge?

How about we just offer subsidized education for as many years as people would like? After all, knowledge is good.

I'm not a "bootstraps" guy, but at a certain point you've been given enough free education and need to obtain more "knowledge" at your own expense instead of at everyone else's.

That said, I think we need to dramatically shift our current education system towards STEM with more rigorous classes and year round schooling.
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I don't think opposition to the different free college proposals is the same as opposing knowledge.

For autodidacts, education is basically subsidized for life already.

Anyways, I'm just offering one simple reason why a state might offer tuition-free higher ed.
 
cville deac said:
Or maybe you just pay more attention to their economic agendas than their social agendas. They share a fair amount economically but are diametrically opposed socially.
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So Trump's gonna raise taxes on the rich/corporations and generate money from Wall Street speculation?
 
wsc8521s said:
So Trump's gonna raise taxes on the rich/corporations and generate money from Wall Street speculation?
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I've read where he has said he was going to raise taxes on the rich and penalize corporations who leave the US. Although pinning down the Donald isn't always easy. Donald and Bernie are both anti free trade and would likely get us into tariff battles.
 
Liquid Karma said:
The counter to that is the government already subsidizes 12 years of "free" education. Why extend it 2 or 4 more years?
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I'm all for making high schools more responsive so more students can get jobs straight out of high school.

On the other hand, I can understand why someone may need more years of schooling in 2017 than my classmates did over 20 years ago to get just as far in an everchanging world.
 
Liquid Karma said:
You're implying that opposing this is to oppose knowledge?

How about we just offer subsidized education for as many years as people would like? After all, knowledge is good.

I'm not a "bootstraps" guy, but at a certain point you've been given enough free education and need to obtain more "knowledge" at your own expense instead of at everyone else's.

That said, I think we need to dramatically shift our current education system towards STEM with more rigorous classes and year round schooling.
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I think he was just quoting Emil Faber.
 
TuffaloDeac10 said:
I don't think opposition to the different free college proposals is the same as opposing knowledge.

For autodidacts, education is basically subsidized for life already.

Anyways, I'm just offering one simple reason why a state might offer tuition-free higher ed.
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How is the state of California's financial situation doing these days?
 
PhDeac said:
I'm all for making high schools more responsive so more students can get jobs straight out of high school.

On the other hand, I can understand why someone may need more years of schooling in 2017 than my classmates did over 20 years ago to get just as far in an everchanging world.[/QUOTE]

And, obviously, the taxpayers are who should fund all of this. PH & the Democrats are big on using OPM to fund all of their pet projects.
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