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Iraq 3.0

jhmd2000 said:
I would say that is accurate, but the practical effect is there aren't many Western countries that are ruled from the very top by followers of the Westboro Baptist Church.

Where are the countries in the Islamic world where women's rights are respected? Those of homosexuals? Why do Muslim men sanction the honor killings of their own daughters? Stoning people for writing works of fiction? Drawing pictures?

Westboro actually is the minority we are trying to so hard to pretend that ISIS is. One of the most progressive countries in that part of the world is---as we speak---building World Cup venues with slave labor.

We all know Islam has followers that live out its peaceful doctrines, but I need to know why that moderate view has such a hard time gaining traction. There is no shortage of idiots willing to strap bombs to their children to go kill those of others in the hallowed name of the Prophet.

At some point you are what you do, right?
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Hang on a sec there Uncle Sam. America was founded and formed on all those things - slave labor, oppressed women, homosexuals burning at the stake, natives marching out of their ancestral land - a mere 200 years ago. 200 years ain't shit. And now we have just folded slave labor and oppression into our financial/commerce models. Apartheid up until 50 years ago. We install puppet regimes in countries whose resources we want a good deal on and wage war if we have to. Are to believe we are light years better and more morally righteous because we do it with a checkbook and a computerized weapon system and not a bomb strapped to our waist?

You need to know why the moderates have a had time gaining traction? lol they are fucking 500 years behind the rest of the world, and the only reason the tiniest shit is given about them is oil. Any denial of this fact immediately disqualifies your opinion. What, are we over there on a humanitarian mission? You would be doing the same thing if the shoe were on the other foot.

The vast majority of Muslims are peaceful people. You have a handful out of a billion of them who are vulnerable to the influence of extremest murderers.

Hearts and minds. We never won them after 9-11. That is why ISIS exists today.
 
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To be sure, I get it. All people are fucking dirty rotten animals clamoring for resources and territory. So I have a hard time being all incredulous when some guys in Iraq wanna blow the shit out of us and the Jews and the other Muslims. Perhaps they have read their American history and know that the guys who blow up the most shit win the resources and territory, and if they do it in 'Gods' name they can attribute all the bloodshed and misery to 'God's will' and get back to their highball or their women. :noidea: Their God just comes with a different book with a slightly different plot
 
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FUBAR

BxltODxIcAA5FT1.png:large
 
WakeandBake said:
To be sure, I get it. All people are fucking dirty rotten animals clamoring for resources and territory. So I have a hard time being all incredulous when some guys in Iraq wanna blow the shit out of us and the Jews and the other Muslims. Perhaps they have read their American history and know that the guys who blow up the most shit win the resources and territory, and if they do it in 'Gods' name they can attribute all the bloodshed and misery to 'God's will' and get back to their highball or their women. :noidea: Their God just comes with a different book with a slightly different plot
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Sophomoric...I hate to say. Civilization has only moved when a civilizing force has been applied. All empires exhibit the same effects. To assume some over-riding variable which makes American led civilization a purveyor of ills is to be completely unwilling to acknowledge where the world would be without an even imperfect light shining the way for human kind. None of us,thankfully,lived through a dark age. Make no mistake, the Islamic worlds repulsion of the Enlightenment has as much to do with our present state of affairs as does raw American military might. The Promethean aspect of the Enlightenment frightened Muslim orthodoxy - it was man co-opting his own destiny...manipulating nature to suit his ends. It represented the same "hubris" found in all of the ancient desert texts. Mankind was on his way to becoming a machine -(serving Moloch in the Jewish conception). This is the sense they get when they hear of some corporation,say, Google and the writings of lead engineer and futurist, Ray Kurziweil.The idea of some point of "singularity" being achieved in this century when humankind will achieve technological victory over death...well, where you and I might dismiss this proclamation with a "maybe-maybe not" the orthodox Muslims point and say "we see the aim of this and it represents a perverse idolatry in our teaching." So, until we are able,willing or even feel the need to know what drives people to radically different conceptions of what the world should look like we have to agree that there first exists a wholly different world view at the basis of the struggle and widening conflict.

For the orthodoxy in any major religion this has been an obstacle. History has to seem like it it is leading somewhere...there must be a teleological aim and an epistemology and subsequent moral law which reflects the aim. For the orthodox there is meaning in everything and it is not entirely knowable to the viewer. For the westerner it is increasingly becoming individual interpretation as concerns the bigger unanswerable questions and scientific method answers everything up to that point -- of course,this goes hand in hand with the "faith" that science will eventually answer "all the questions" ...therefore speculation and schism rule the modern western church and erstwhile morals are converted into modern 'sins'.

^ now then, this is not an angle marketed by the news sellers as it is easier to hit a common denominator - if not denomination- with the base idea that "these people hate us for our success".

The problem is the collision of cultures and Marshall McLuhan rightly predicted the hostilities which would ensue when electronic media dissolved borders and peoples subjected to cultures not woven of the same cloth. He would always remind his students that the Chinese emperor built the Great Wall to "keep other languages out". Well, that cat is long gone out of the bag.
 
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Lectro said:
Sophomoric...I hate to say. Civilization has only moved when a civilizing force has been applied. All empires exhibit the same effects. To assume some over-riding variable which makes American led civilization a purveyor of ills is to be completely unwilling to acknowledge where the world would be without an even imperfect light shining the way for human kind. None of us,thankfully,lived through a dark age. Make no mistake, the Islamic worlds repulsion of the Enlightenment has as much to do with our present state of affairs as does raw American military might. The Promethean aspect of the Enlightenment frightened Muslim orthodoxy - it was man co-opting his own destiny...manipulating nature to suit his ends. It represented the same "hubris" found in all of the ancient desert texts. Mankind was on his way to becoming a machine -(serving Moloch in the Jewish conception). This is the sense they get when they hear of some corporation,say, Google and the writings of lead engineer and futurist, Ray Kurziweil.The idea of some point of "singularity" being achieved in this century when humankind will achieve technological victory over death...well, where you and I might dismiss this proclamation with a "maybe-maybe not" the orthodox Muslims point and say "we see the aim of this and it represents a perverse idolatry in our teaching." So, until we are able,willing or even feel the need to know what drives people to radically different conceptions of what the world should look like we have to agree that there first exists a wholly different world view at the basis of the struggle and widening conflict.

For the orthodoxy in any major religion this has been an obstacle. History has to seem like it it is leading somewhere...there must be a teleological aim and an epistemology and subsequent moral law which reflects the aim. For the orthodox there is meaning in everything and it is not entirely knowable to the viewer. For the westerner it is increasingly becoming individual interpretation as concerns the bigger unanswerable questions and scientific method answers everything up to that point -- of course,this goes hand in hand with the "faith" that science will eventually answer "all the questions" ...therefore speculation and schism rule the modern western church and erstwhile morals are converted into modern 'sins'.

^ now then, this is not an angle marketed by the news sellers as it is easier to hit a common denominator - if not denomination- with the base idea that "these people hate us for our success".

The problem is the collision of cultures and Marshall McLuhan rightly predicted the hostilities which would ensue when electronic media dissolved borders and peoples subjected to cultures not woven of the same cloth. He would always remind his students that the Chinese emperor built the Great Wall to "keep other languages out". Well, that cat is long gone out of the bag.
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Oh all of my posts are sophomoric, no doubt.

I don't really disagree with the ideas here I guess, their resistance of enlightenment etc., except that America is the "even imperfect light that shines the way for humankind." Bleh My post was a pithy three-sentence summation of my exception to that very idea, really. America loves to see itself that way, but it's self-indulgence and lack of morals and view of (other) human life as disposable are what fuel the resistance of the orthodox. If you want to bring them along, blowing the shit out of them every ten years and moving them around like pawns and lying to them isn't going to make it happen peacefully. Maybe it is the only way, I don't know I can't see the future, but the past 13 years of the "war on terror" haven't moved the objective forward too much, have they?
 
Lectro said:
Sophomoric...I hate to say. Civilization has only moved when a civilizing force has been applied. All empires exhibit the same effects. To assume some over-riding variable which makes American led civilization a purveyor of ills is to be completely unwilling to acknowledge where the world would be without an even imperfect light shining the way for human kind. None of us,thankfully,lived through a dark age. Make no mistake, the Islamic worlds repulsion of the Enlightenment has as much to do with our present state of affairs as does raw American military might. The Promethean aspect of the Enlightenment frightened Muslim orthodoxy - it was man co-opting his own destiny...manipulating nature to suit his ends. It represented the same "hubris" found in all of the ancient desert texts. Mankind was on his way to becoming a machine -(serving Moloch in the Jewish conception). This is the sense they get when they hear of some corporation,say, Google and the writings of lead engineer and futurist, Ray Kurziweil.The idea of some point of "singularity" being achieved in this century when humankind will achieve technological victory over death...well, where you and I might dismiss this proclamation with a "maybe-maybe not" the orthodox Muslims point and say "we see the aim of this and it represents a perverse idolatry in our teaching." So, until we are able,willing or even feel the need to know what drives people to radically different conceptions of what the world should look like we have to agree that there first exists a wholly different world view at the basis of the struggle and widening conflict.

For the orthodoxy in any major religion this has been an obstacle. History has to seem like it it is leading somewhere...there must be a teleological aim and an epistemology and subsequent moral law which reflects the aim. For the orthodox there is meaning in everything and it is not entirely knowable to the viewer. For the westerner it is increasingly becoming individual interpretation as concerns the bigger unanswerable questions and scientific method answers everything up to that point -- of course,this goes hand in hand with the "faith" that science will eventually answer "all the questions" ...therefore speculation and schism rule the modern western church and erstwhile morals are converted into modern 'sins'.

^ now then, this is not an angle marketed by the news sellers as it is easier to hit a common denominator - if not denomination- with the base idea that "these people hate us for our success".

The problem is the collision of cultures and Marshall McLuhan rightly predicted the hostilities which would ensue when electronic media dissolved borders and peoples subjected to cultures not woven of the same cloth. He would always remind his students that the Chinese emperor built the Great Wall to "keep other languages out". Well, that cat is long gone out of the bag.
Click to expand...

Sophomoric! That's the perfect word I've been looking for!

Thanks lec.
 
TownieDeac said:
Sophomoric! That's the perfect word I've been looking for!

Thanks lec.
Click to expand...

Absolutely,good man.

You just keep living it and I'll keep pointing it out by name.

And btw, with your condition there exists a more explicit form which captures the acutest of cases...known simply as "Sophomoronic"
 
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Either way they're right!
 
TownieDeac said:
fox news killin it so far

BxqKyr4CYAIIVad.jpg:large
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My guess is the bottom caption was referring to the international coalition, not specifically the US.

In other news, Australia has reportedly broken up a domestic plot to kidnap a "member of the public" who would then be publicly executed and draped in an ISIS flag.
 
More Fox News BS

Alarmest Title: Law enforcement bulletin warned of ISIS urging jihad attacks on US soil

Questionable Sources: Twitter

Truth buried in the middle of alarmist rhetoric: "On Thursday, Peter Boogaard, a spokesman for the Department of Homeland Security, told FoxNews.com that "there is no credible intelligence at this time to suggest that there is an active plot by (ISIS) to carry out an attack in the United States."

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/0...-warned-isis-urging-jihad-attacks-on-us-soil/
 
Nice to see F-22 Raptors flying right in the kitchen of a Russian-made I.A.D.S. system, deliver American goodwill to our terrorist friends 2,000 lbs. at a time and return its pilot safely home to their families. There's a reason that Vegas doesn't post lines for the game of Rock-Butterknife-JDAM.

Might as well pray to the South b/c you don't have a prayer against what's coming your way from the West.
 
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