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Question for Buzziners

TBR said:
You're missing my entire point it seems.

I'm not talking about the wins and losses or even the margins, I am talking about how well they played despite their limitations regarding experience, talent, and learning a new system.
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Exactly, it's not about wins and losses. Except for a few losses to teams we should never lose to, I don't care about the losses. It's the complete lack of development in our players that bothers me.
 
No one should believe he will get the axe tonight if we lose by 20. He's going to be around at least 1 more year, probably more if we are .500 next year. Wellman and the BuzzInners will claim victory.
 
Wait, Bennett gets a bad rap for having some players transfer? Last I checked several highly ranked players chose not to stay at wake and play for bzz.
 
deaconson said:
Wait, Bennett gets a bad rap for having some players transfer? Last I checked several highly ranked players chose not to stay at wake and play for bzz.
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Yeah, but that was addition by subtraction, that's completely different. ;)
 
DeacsOrDie said:
I think alot of the Buzz-n-waiting people are waiting on the "Calvary" to arrive. Having two of the worst seasons in ACC history and still be able to put together a top 10-25 class in some rankings is something to sit and wait for, for certain people. I am rather shocked to see Bzz/wake pull in this type of class, under the circumstances.
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I agree with that...I think Buzz has proven he can find talent and is especially good at identifying talent under the radar. However, it's also obvious that he is just not a head coach material. I think he makes a great assistant coach, which is where he spent most of his time in the NBA (scout and asst) and how he came so highly referenced was because of his scouting abilities. However, being a good scout and a good HC are completely different things and it is apparent that he is just not HC material. In an ideal world he steps down and we get a new HC but he stays as asst. coach to scout talent. This would never happen as his and Wellman's ego is way too big, but a guy can hope.
 
greekdeac2011 said:
No one should believe he will get the axe tonight if we lose by 20. He's going to be around at least 1 more year, probably more if we are .500 next year. Wellman and the BuzzInners will claim victory.
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Hold on Buzzinners still exist? I thought they became extinct after the Clemson massacre
 
ironwill24 said:
I agree with that...I think Buzz has proven he can find talent and is especially good at identifying talent under the radar. However, it's also obvious that he is just not a head coach material. I think he makes a great assistant coach, which is where he spent most of his time in the NBA (scout and asst) and how he came so highly referenced was because of his scouting abilities. However, being a good scout and a good HC are completely different things and it is apparent that he is just not HC material. In an ideal world he steps down and we get a new HC but he stays as asst. coach to scout talent. This would never happen as his and Wellman's ego is way too big, but a guy can hope.
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Yes, but isn't our class only the 5th or so rated class amoung ACC schools? I mean it's a good class and I'm excited we've got them, but individually it's not really a worldbeater class on paper is it? I guess I've learned to temper my excitement over recruiting classes based on the flop of the AT&T class (as a whole) and last year's class which was supposed to be really good as well. As bad as we are right now, I don't know if it's fair to think what we've got coming in can make enough difference for us to reach decent. We're a long ways from decent.
 
TBR said:
You're missing my entire point it seems.

I'm not talking about the wins and losses or even the margins, I am talking about how well they played despite their limitations regarding experience, talent, and learning a new system.
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I get that. Though again, I think you are barking up the wrong coach. That team did lose their last 9 regular season games of the season just like we did last year under our first year coach. That team lost a 4star underclassman after the year who was their best player (Landesburg). We lost a 4star underclassman right after the year (Ari). JTT was a little different. The thing is, the next year, year 2, Bennett recruited some good 4star talent and they left (Johnson, Spurlock). He went 16-15. What are we going to end up in year 2? 13-18? 14-17? In year 3, Bennett recruited some good 4star talent who again left (Harrell, and somebody else, right?) but he has his relatively young 3star underclassmen and 4-star senior at 20 wins and a bubble team. Bzd's 3rd year will be next year.

What I'm saying is that Bennett's results are pretty on money with what we've done. Except we didn't have any defections in year 2 the way bennett did.

You can argue that they played better with less talent and improved through the course of the year, but that's pretty subjective. Year 1 they lost their last 9 games, so hard to argue they got better.
 
jaybone said:
I get that. Though again, I think you are barking up the wrong coach. That team did lose their last 9 regular season games of the season just like we did last year under our first year coach. That team lost a 4star underclassman after the year who was their best player (Landesburg). We lost a 4star underclassman right after the year (Ari). JTT was a little different. The thing is, the next year, year 2, Bennett recruited some good 4star talent and they left (Johnson, Spurlock). He went 16-15. What are we going to end up in year 2? 13-18? 14-17? In year 3, Bennett recruited some good 4star talent who again left (Harrell, and somebody else, right?) but he has his relatively young 3star underclassmen and 4-star senior at 20 wins and a bubble team. Bzd's 3rd year will be next year.

What I'm saying is that Bennett's results are pretty on money with what we've done. Except we didn't have any defections in year 2 the way bennett did.

You can argue that they played better with less talent and improved through the course of the year, but that's pretty subjective. Year 1 they lost their last 9 games, so hard to argue they got better.
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bzz has not had defections in year two yet. jtt is different only in that he got a dui in town. he could easily have stayed if he wanted to play for bzz. he left and immediately showed up out west.

subjective is the name of the game with bzz. he has ZERO evidence on his entire resume (including a dismal record at wake) that he is more than a mediocre coach. everything that is said about him is that he "knows his stuff" "x and o's guru" "wait till he gets his guys." etc it's all subject with no support from his previous results.

oops sorry. there is one paper result that shows clear improvement from last year. he doubled our acc wins...
 
ironwill24 said:
Hold on Buzzinners still exist? I thought they became extinct after the Clemson massacre
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There are a few, and some Buzzwaitandseers, which still boggle my mind. He's had almost 2 seasons. I suppose next year we will finish 15-16 and Wellman and his followers will claim the turnaround is complete and hand him an extension.
 
Aren't Green & Fields "his guys"? They rarely leave the bench for a team that has lost 9 of 10 games. Shouldn't he see how these 2 fit in his so called system and we see them evolve into their role?
 
daaberry said:
Aren't Green & Fields "his guys"? They rarely leave the bench for a team that has lost 9 of 10 games. Shouldn't he see how these 2 fit in his so called system and we see them evolve into their role?
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Buzz did the best he could with what he had to work with so late in the game.

Wellman is judging Buzz by next year's class and beyond.

Like I said, a well placed insider assures me that Wellman considers next year Year 1 for Buzz.

These past 2 years are on Dino.
 
deacondemonzzzz said:
Buzz did the best he could with what he had to work with so late in the game.

Wellman is judging Buzz by next year's class and beyond.

Like I said, a well placed insider assures me that Wellman considers next year Year 1 for Buzz.

These past 2 years are on Dino.
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Negative. The majority of personnel are on Dino. In game coaching (or lack thereof) and progression are on Buzz.
 
deacondemonzzzz said:
Buzz did the best he could with what he had to work with so late in the game.

Wellman is judging Buzz by next year's class and beyond.

Like I said, a well placed insider assures me that Wellman considers next year Year 1 for Buzz.

These past 2 years are on Dino.
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I have absolutely no doubt that is Ron Wellman's thinking.
 
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